1
00:00:03,830 --> 00:00:01,990
and good evening everyone welcome to

2
00:00:06,230 --> 00:00:03,840
arcane radio i'm sean the fort chop

3
00:00:08,230 --> 00:00:06,240
forker as always joined by lon strickler

4
00:00:10,310 --> 00:00:08,240
on this nice monday night

5
00:00:12,150 --> 00:00:10,320
here in the new studio lon how are you

6
00:00:15,190 --> 00:00:12,160
doing tonight big guy

7
00:00:18,710 --> 00:00:15,200
take it out my friend dig it out

8
00:00:20,230 --> 00:00:18,720
uh but hell is only 30 inches

9
00:00:23,590 --> 00:00:20,240
you got an awful lot of snow i didn't

10
00:00:27,589 --> 00:00:23,600
get any uh you're lucky

11
00:00:28,950 --> 00:00:27,599
yes we got snowzilla this year so um

12
00:00:31,269 --> 00:00:28,960
i don't know i hope we don't get any

13
00:00:33,590 --> 00:00:31,279
more but

14
00:00:34,709 --> 00:00:33,600
yeah we're going to deal with it

15
00:00:36,790 --> 00:00:34,719
unfortunately so

16
00:00:38,709 --> 00:00:36,800
i wish we didn't have so much snow uh

17
00:00:42,150 --> 00:00:38,719
well you did i didn't get any again like

18
00:00:46,869 --> 00:00:45,190
that's odd that is really odd uh

19
00:00:48,790 --> 00:00:46,879
you know as far as weather goes we're

20
00:00:51,990 --> 00:00:48,800
not really that far apart

21
00:00:53,590 --> 00:00:52,000
and uh you know if you get it i mean if

22
00:00:56,630 --> 00:00:53,600
i get it you usually get it

23
00:00:58,310 --> 00:00:56,640
and uh that didn't happen this time no

24
00:01:00,790 --> 00:00:58,320
blizzard jonas was really selective

25
00:01:03,110 --> 00:01:00,800
about what was going on let me tell you

26
00:01:04,310 --> 00:01:03,120
yeah that thing went up at 95 and just

27
00:01:08,550 --> 00:01:04,320
kept on going and

28
00:01:10,870 --> 00:01:08,560
um that's the way it was

29
00:01:11,590 --> 00:01:10,880
well hopefully people notice the

30
00:01:13,429 --> 00:01:11,600
difference

31
00:01:15,830 --> 00:01:13,439
in our sound tonight lon i think i sound

32
00:01:18,310 --> 00:01:15,840
a whole lot better what do you think

33
00:01:21,109 --> 00:01:18,320
i i think it sounds pretty good uh you

34
00:01:25,270 --> 00:01:21,119
know hopefully this will keep going

35
00:01:28,070 --> 00:01:25,280
uh you know of course you know always

36
00:01:29,270 --> 00:01:28,080
we're always at the whim of skype but uh

37
00:01:30,950 --> 00:01:29,280
as far as

38
00:01:33,030 --> 00:01:30,960
the equipment and everything and you

39
00:01:35,590 --> 00:01:33,040
know be you being in the new studio

40
00:01:36,710 --> 00:01:35,600
i i think it sounds pretty good no echo

41
00:01:40,149 --> 00:01:36,720
new microphone i

42
00:01:41,190 --> 00:01:40,159
invested in one of these new blue yeti

43
00:01:42,630 --> 00:01:41,200
microphones

44
00:01:44,149 --> 00:01:42,640
the blackout edition of course it's

45
00:01:45,350 --> 00:01:44,159
going to match my decor here really

46
00:01:47,350 --> 00:01:45,360
awesome i love it

47
00:01:48,469 --> 00:01:47,360
but the sound is fantastic i can't get

48
00:01:53,670 --> 00:01:48,479
enough

49
00:02:00,069 --> 00:01:57,590
yeah yep well that's great

50
00:02:01,510 --> 00:02:00,079
so tonight was the second night of

51
00:02:04,789 --> 00:02:01,520
x-files

52
00:02:05,190 --> 00:02:04,799
so what'd you think about it man i liked

53
00:02:07,429 --> 00:02:05,200
it

54
00:02:08,710 --> 00:02:07,439
um last night i watched the episode and

55
00:02:09,830 --> 00:02:08,720
of course anybody who follows me on

56
00:02:11,670 --> 00:02:09,840
facebook

57
00:02:14,150 --> 00:02:11,680
uh understood that i was pretty pissed

58
00:02:18,150 --> 00:02:14,160
that we had to watch the post game show

59
00:02:19,830 --> 00:02:18,160
up until like 24 minutes to the uh

60
00:02:21,589 --> 00:02:19,840
into the hour i was a little upset you

61
00:02:23,350 --> 00:02:21,599
know fox knew

62
00:02:24,949 --> 00:02:23,360
that there was a game and they've been

63
00:02:26,309 --> 00:02:24,959
promoting that the x-files was going to

64
00:02:27,830 --> 00:02:26,319
start at 10

65
00:02:29,510 --> 00:02:27,840
he should have started at 10. that's all

66
00:02:30,470 --> 00:02:29,520
i'm saying and instead i had to sit

67
00:02:32,150 --> 00:02:30,480
through

68
00:02:33,750 --> 00:02:32,160
terry bradshaw who now looks like

69
00:02:37,430 --> 00:02:33,760
herschel from the walking dead

70
00:02:39,110 --> 00:02:37,440
thanks to that beard he sprouted and uh

71
00:02:40,630 --> 00:02:39,120
jeff gordon whatever in the hell jeff

72
00:02:42,550 --> 00:02:40,640
gordon has to do with football i don't

73
00:02:44,309 --> 00:02:42,560
know but unless he was chasing ufos he

74
00:02:46,309 --> 00:02:44,319
didn't need to be on my tv

75
00:02:48,869 --> 00:02:46,319
it's fox it's [\h__\h] i'll tell you what

76
00:02:51,990 --> 00:02:50,309
you know they're going to put the nascar

77
00:02:52,550 --> 00:02:52,000
crowd in there and all that other stuff

78
00:02:54,070 --> 00:02:52,560
it

79
00:02:55,990 --> 00:02:54,080
that's that's just the way they do

80
00:02:57,509 --> 00:02:56,000
things so um yeah

81
00:02:59,750 --> 00:02:57,519
i wasn't happy about it either because

82
00:03:00,790 --> 00:02:59,760
frankly i i taped it because i was doing

83
00:03:03,670 --> 00:03:00,800
the radio show

84
00:03:05,589 --> 00:03:03,680
the other radio show last night and i

85
00:03:07,509 --> 00:03:05,599
taped it and when i went to turn it on

86
00:03:10,229 --> 00:03:07,519
there's the football stuff

87
00:03:12,949 --> 00:03:10,239
and have to sure get lost so i actually

88
00:03:16,470 --> 00:03:12,959
did stay up to four o'clock this morning

89
00:03:18,229 --> 00:03:16,480
to watch the first episode on the band

90
00:03:20,390 --> 00:03:18,239
and like i said the first episode lawn

91
00:03:21,030 --> 00:03:20,400
to me good not great it got better

92
00:03:22,949 --> 00:03:21,040
tonight

93
00:03:24,309 --> 00:03:22,959
if you know folks tuned in to catch the

94
00:03:26,550 --> 00:03:24,319
second uh

95
00:03:28,390 --> 00:03:26,560
episode at the eight o'clock hour on uh

96
00:03:29,830 --> 00:03:28,400
eastern time on fox it was a good

97
00:03:30,949 --> 00:03:29,840
episode and next week looks like it's

98
00:03:33,190 --> 00:03:30,959
gonna be

99
00:03:34,789 --> 00:03:33,200
kind of back to the monster of the week

100
00:03:36,390 --> 00:03:34,799
so to speak episode so i'm looking

101
00:03:38,630 --> 00:03:36,400
forward to it it brings a lot of fun

102
00:03:40,869 --> 00:03:38,640
i enjoyed it i'm gonna have to warm up

103
00:03:44,070 --> 00:03:40,879
to it again

104
00:03:46,070 --> 00:03:44,080
well i you know i think they're i think

105
00:03:49,750 --> 00:03:46,080
they're gonna try to go more deep into

106
00:03:52,949 --> 00:03:49,760
government conspiracy as opposed to uh

107
00:03:56,149 --> 00:03:52,959
the single alien ufo

108
00:03:59,990 --> 00:03:56,159
conspiracy and

109
00:04:02,949 --> 00:04:00,000
if that's the case uh as what we would

110
00:04:03,830 --> 00:04:02,959
watch last night i think they're getting

111
00:04:07,030 --> 00:04:03,840
closer to

112
00:04:09,509 --> 00:04:07,040
what the reality of things are and i i

113
00:04:11,110 --> 00:04:09,519
put in the blog today that i think that

114
00:04:13,190 --> 00:04:11,120
because of it they're gonna be more

115
00:04:14,070 --> 00:04:13,200
actually more questions as a result of

116
00:04:16,870 --> 00:04:14,080
it

117
00:04:17,990 --> 00:04:16,880
uh i really do believe that and you know

118
00:04:20,710 --> 00:04:18,000
tonight's

119
00:04:22,550 --> 00:04:20,720
episode kind of reinforced that uh they

120
00:04:26,230 --> 00:04:22,560
were basically talking about the

121
00:04:29,350 --> 00:04:26,240
um about human manipulation

122
00:04:32,070 --> 00:04:29,360
it was more of a government than

123
00:04:34,150 --> 00:04:32,080
alien and it does seem that going back

124
00:04:34,790 --> 00:04:34,160
to the monsters was funny because i

125
00:04:38,550 --> 00:04:34,800
caught

126
00:04:40,710 --> 00:04:38,560
freebie for the next week and she

127
00:04:42,710 --> 00:04:40,720
mulder was telling skully and it's a

128
00:04:45,430 --> 00:04:42,720
monster uh it's a monster

129
00:04:46,230 --> 00:04:45,440
episode it's a monster case the next one

130
00:04:48,950 --> 00:04:46,240
and

131
00:04:49,990 --> 00:04:48,960
she tells him well you the the internet

132
00:04:52,150 --> 00:04:50,000
is not good for you

133
00:04:54,469 --> 00:04:52,160
yeah that's all he's reading fans and

134
00:04:57,270 --> 00:04:54,479
monsters so

135
00:04:59,270 --> 00:04:57,280
i'm afraid i'm to blame for that that's

136
00:05:02,070 --> 00:04:59,280
he was reading families and monsters

137
00:05:03,909 --> 00:05:02,080
yeah that's what that's fantastic that's

138
00:05:05,909 --> 00:05:03,919
fantastic and folks

139
00:05:07,670 --> 00:05:05,919
you can always go to faminesmonsters.com

140
00:05:08,469 --> 00:05:07,680
to catch up on the latest and greatest

141
00:05:09,590 --> 00:05:08,479
news

142
00:05:11,189 --> 00:05:09,600
in the world of the paranormal

143
00:05:12,710 --> 00:05:11,199
unexplained encrypted zoology but

144
00:05:14,629 --> 00:05:12,720
speaking of which lawn

145
00:05:16,230 --> 00:05:14,639
what do we have this week to talk about

146
00:05:20,150 --> 00:05:16,240
in terms of uh

147
00:05:22,629 --> 00:05:20,160
crazy crypto capers strange phenomena

148
00:05:25,110 --> 00:05:22,639
uh i did see you posted a little bit of

149
00:05:27,830 --> 00:05:25,120
an update on the todd c's case

150
00:05:29,909 --> 00:05:27,840
yeah you know it was funny uh somebody

151
00:05:31,430 --> 00:05:29,919
had thought started a thread

152
00:05:33,510 --> 00:05:31,440
i figured out what happened somebody had

153
00:05:36,550 --> 00:05:33,520
started a thread over at

154
00:05:40,469 --> 00:05:36,560
um over on reddit

155
00:05:42,950 --> 00:05:40,479
and uh it was in the um mysterious

156
00:05:44,070 --> 00:05:42,960
unexplained reddit i don't know which

157
00:05:47,189 --> 00:05:44,080
one it was but

158
00:05:49,029 --> 00:05:47,199
anyway they um

159
00:05:50,710 --> 00:05:49,039
i was questioning the tits these cases

160
00:05:56,309 --> 00:05:50,720
they put my uh

161
00:05:58,150 --> 00:05:56,319
i was getting all kinds of questions

162
00:05:59,990 --> 00:05:58,160
coming over on reddit then i was getting

163
00:06:02,309 --> 00:06:00,000
questions coming in the email

164
00:06:04,790 --> 00:06:02,319
about this about the todd c's case and

165
00:06:07,590 --> 00:06:04,800
what's been going on updates or anything

166
00:06:08,950 --> 00:06:07,600
so i basically i called butch and i told

167
00:06:11,510 --> 00:06:08,960
him look you know

168
00:06:12,309 --> 00:06:11,520
i wrote up an update i wrote up a little

169
00:06:13,830 --> 00:06:12,319
notice that

170
00:06:15,590 --> 00:06:13,840
we're going to have to post because

171
00:06:16,710 --> 00:06:15,600
we're getting a whole lot of inquiries

172
00:06:20,150 --> 00:06:16,720
now

173
00:06:23,189 --> 00:06:20,160
and basically what i posted

174
00:06:25,430 --> 00:06:23,199
was that all in all we're not

175
00:06:27,510 --> 00:06:25,440
done investigating there's more going on

176
00:06:29,510 --> 00:06:27,520
there's a lot more to be investigated

177
00:06:33,270 --> 00:06:29,520
uh we're hoping to get more evidence as

178
00:06:36,390 --> 00:06:33,280
we go but at this point

179
00:06:39,070 --> 00:06:36,400
we do believe that there's a fit greater

180
00:06:43,270 --> 00:06:39,080
than 50 percent

181
00:06:45,830 --> 00:06:43,280
probability that there is a ufo

182
00:06:51,510 --> 00:06:45,840
connection to

183
00:06:53,350 --> 00:06:51,520
fences and we base that on the evidence

184
00:06:55,270 --> 00:06:53,360
we base that on everything we've been

185
00:06:59,189 --> 00:06:55,280
able to

186
00:07:02,309 --> 00:06:59,199
uh gather including the forensics

187
00:07:04,070 --> 00:07:02,319
and the uh the autopsy report the full

188
00:07:06,950 --> 00:07:04,080
autopsy report

189
00:07:08,870 --> 00:07:06,960
other forensics and uh the actual

190
00:07:09,830 --> 00:07:08,880
situation and how things were handled

191
00:07:11,670 --> 00:07:09,840
and

192
00:07:13,029 --> 00:07:11,680
who was involved in the investigation

193
00:07:15,589 --> 00:07:13,039
the original investigation

194
00:07:16,550 --> 00:07:15,599
and right now that's what we're looking

195
00:07:20,230 --> 00:07:16,560
at

196
00:07:22,230 --> 00:07:20,240
so uh you know i'm i'm

197
00:07:23,909 --> 00:07:22,240
feel satisfied making that statement

198
00:07:25,589 --> 00:07:23,919
which was okay with it

199
00:07:26,950 --> 00:07:25,599
so you know people want a question to

200
00:07:28,710 --> 00:07:26,960
find but you know

201
00:07:30,790 --> 00:07:28,720
they got other evidence to the contrary

202
00:07:32,230 --> 00:07:30,800
hey let us know

203
00:07:33,830 --> 00:07:32,240
yeah i mean you guys met with some

204
00:07:35,510 --> 00:07:33,840
resistance too when you

205
00:07:37,270 --> 00:07:35,520
started going into this case and of

206
00:07:38,710 --> 00:07:37,280
course we've talked about it ad nauseam

207
00:07:39,749 --> 00:07:38,720
on the program and i don't want to bore

208
00:07:41,670 --> 00:07:39,759
everybody

209
00:07:42,950 --> 00:07:41,680
uh you know by going in and not really

210
00:07:44,469 --> 00:07:42,960
bore them i guess because if they were

211
00:07:46,070 --> 00:07:44,479
bored by it they wouldn't be listening

212
00:07:48,070 --> 00:07:46,080
but uh you know spending all the time to

213
00:07:49,830 --> 00:07:48,080
go back and go over this case but

214
00:07:51,589 --> 00:07:49,840
it hasn't actually actually been

215
00:07:53,430 --> 00:07:51,599
welcomed by the community

216
00:07:56,070 --> 00:07:53,440
hasn't been welcomed by the ufo

217
00:07:58,550 --> 00:07:56,080
community at all and you guys have been

218
00:08:00,469 --> 00:07:58,560
uh uh kind of kicked in the crotch a lot

219
00:08:02,070 --> 00:08:00,479
around on this

220
00:08:03,670 --> 00:08:02,080
well that's just it and that's what i

221
00:08:06,710 --> 00:08:03,680
told people i said look

222
00:08:08,950 --> 00:08:06,720
uh there's a reason why other people

223
00:08:11,270 --> 00:08:08,960
didn't investigate this thing

224
00:08:12,390 --> 00:08:11,280
uh and that the biggest reason is

225
00:08:15,830 --> 00:08:12,400
because

226
00:08:18,390 --> 00:08:15,840
there was a fear factor there it

227
00:08:19,830 --> 00:08:18,400
it seemed any time anybody started

228
00:08:23,350 --> 00:08:19,840
nosing around

229
00:08:26,230 --> 00:08:23,360
they got pushed back and also

230
00:08:26,629 --> 00:08:26,240
it was impossible to get information

231
00:08:29,749 --> 00:08:26,639
from

232
00:08:32,310 --> 00:08:29,759
government and local sources

233
00:08:34,149 --> 00:08:32,320
and in fact we we never knew anything

234
00:08:35,269 --> 00:08:34,159
about a social security number or any

235
00:08:38,790 --> 00:08:35,279
other

236
00:08:39,990 --> 00:08:38,800
information on seas until the day after

237
00:08:44,070 --> 00:08:40,000
we did the radio interview

238
00:08:47,670 --> 00:08:44,080
on bte back in february of 2014

239
00:08:50,710 --> 00:08:47,680
uh the next day ancestry.com

240
00:08:53,590 --> 00:08:50,720
stuff started popping up

241
00:08:54,710 --> 00:08:53,600
which was yeah and uh so something was

242
00:08:59,030 --> 00:08:54,720
going on there

243
00:09:01,509 --> 00:08:59,040
and uh uh

244
00:09:02,310 --> 00:09:01,519
i i don't think i don't think that was a

245
00:09:05,110 --> 00:09:02,320
coincidence

246
00:09:06,630 --> 00:09:05,120
i think that was you know i think the

247
00:09:09,030 --> 00:09:06,640
powers be figured they better give us a

248
00:09:09,670 --> 00:09:09,040
little bit before we start digging in

249
00:09:11,990 --> 00:09:09,680
too deep

250
00:09:14,150 --> 00:09:12,000
well you know we're still digging well i

251
00:09:15,829 --> 00:09:14,160
think people have to realize too that

252
00:09:18,150 --> 00:09:15,839
you know you've only been working on

253
00:09:20,070 --> 00:09:18,160
this case for about two years

254
00:09:21,750 --> 00:09:20,080
and uh the fact that you guys have done

255
00:09:22,070 --> 00:09:21,760
a ton of investigating on this in two

256
00:09:24,230 --> 00:09:22,080
years

257
00:09:26,150 --> 00:09:24,240
is uh phenomenal and there's been other

258
00:09:27,670 --> 00:09:26,160
people associated with too that we don't

259
00:09:29,350 --> 00:09:27,680
bring out to the forefront just for

260
00:09:31,990 --> 00:09:29,360
their own

261
00:09:33,190 --> 00:09:32,000
personal interests i've met a couple the

262
00:09:34,790 --> 00:09:33,200
uh or at least one of the other

263
00:09:37,509 --> 00:09:34,800
investigators on this case

264
00:09:39,430 --> 00:09:37,519
and a very professional guy law

265
00:09:41,829 --> 00:09:39,440
enforcement background again

266
00:09:42,630 --> 00:09:41,839
uh if anybody knows anything about lon

267
00:09:44,310 --> 00:09:42,640
and myself

268
00:09:45,670 --> 00:09:44,320
and the particular projects that we do

269
00:09:47,350 --> 00:09:45,680
we like to have people of the law

270
00:09:49,269 --> 00:09:47,360
enforcement background

271
00:09:50,949 --> 00:09:49,279
uh to assist us in some of these things

272
00:09:52,470 --> 00:09:50,959
because they you know

273
00:09:54,470 --> 00:09:52,480
are pretty good at the investigation

274
00:09:56,949 --> 00:09:54,480
part anyhow

275
00:09:57,990 --> 00:09:56,959
well of course butch has got his cold

276
00:10:00,470 --> 00:09:58,000
case

277
00:10:02,069 --> 00:10:00,480
and then he's got a lot of investigators

278
00:10:04,069 --> 00:10:02,079
on there that you know

279
00:10:06,710 --> 00:10:04,079
know what they're doing at court we we

280
00:10:08,710 --> 00:10:06,720
actually have gotten some assets now

281
00:10:09,829 --> 00:10:08,720
in the northumberland area which is

282
00:10:13,030 --> 00:10:09,839
fantastic

283
00:10:16,550 --> 00:10:13,040
yeah uh you know so um

284
00:10:18,550 --> 00:10:16,560
yeah anything pops up that you know

285
00:10:20,310 --> 00:10:18,560
that we can use we're going to use it

286
00:10:21,750 --> 00:10:20,320
and uh

287
00:10:23,590 --> 00:10:21,760
you know the biggest thing about this

288
00:10:26,470 --> 00:10:23,600
case was dispelling all

289
00:10:28,150 --> 00:10:26,480
the uh the conjecture because quite

290
00:10:30,550 --> 00:10:28,160
frankly the original

291
00:10:32,389 --> 00:10:30,560
the original case file from peter

292
00:10:33,829 --> 00:10:32,399
davenport though i gave him credit for

293
00:10:36,630 --> 00:10:33,839
doing it

294
00:10:38,150 --> 00:10:36,640
had a lot of uh had a lot of false

295
00:10:40,790 --> 00:10:38,160
information in it

296
00:10:41,509 --> 00:10:40,800
uh he thought you know he thought that

297
00:10:44,550 --> 00:10:41,519
it was

298
00:10:47,829 --> 00:10:44,560
good information but

299
00:10:51,110 --> 00:10:47,839
you know there were sources feeding

300
00:10:51,750 --> 00:10:51,120
a lot of uh a lot of false information

301
00:10:54,630 --> 00:10:51,760
and uh

302
00:10:56,310 --> 00:10:54,640
unfortunately most people think that's

303
00:10:58,790 --> 00:10:56,320
actually what had happened and that's

304
00:11:00,949 --> 00:10:58,800
just not what happened

305
00:11:02,069 --> 00:11:00,959
yeah but you have to kind of assume some

306
00:11:03,590 --> 00:11:02,079
of that stuff's going to happen in a

307
00:11:04,790 --> 00:11:03,600
case like this that the information

308
00:11:08,790 --> 00:11:04,800
you're going to be throwing down

309
00:11:12,310 --> 00:11:08,800
rabbit trails and uh led astray

310
00:11:13,509 --> 00:11:12,320
uh away from the you know the

311
00:11:16,230 --> 00:11:13,519
information you're actually trying to

312
00:11:19,190 --> 00:11:16,240
get supplant the fake information to

313
00:11:20,230 --> 00:11:19,200
kind of throw you off course yeah well i

314
00:11:21,670 --> 00:11:20,240
mean i've been

315
00:11:23,990 --> 00:11:21,680
i've been interested in this case from

316
00:11:24,470 --> 00:11:24,000
the day it happened the day i found out

317
00:11:28,310 --> 00:11:24,480
about it

318
00:11:29,590 --> 00:11:28,320
and uh uh you know i i like everybody

319
00:11:31,990 --> 00:11:29,600
else kind of let it go

320
00:11:33,829 --> 00:11:32,000
and uh you know i i really didn't decide

321
00:11:34,710 --> 00:11:33,839
to do it until that day we were talking

322
00:11:38,069 --> 00:11:34,720
about it

323
00:11:42,069 --> 00:11:38,079
up in gettysburg and uh i

324
00:11:43,829 --> 00:11:42,079
uh i said that day i said look

325
00:11:45,269 --> 00:11:43,839
i'm tired of screwing around with this i

326
00:11:48,310 --> 00:11:45,279
i want to get deep in this

327
00:11:50,230 --> 00:11:48,320
find out what happened and uh

328
00:11:52,230 --> 00:11:50,240
of course butch got a hold of me he was

329
00:11:53,269 --> 00:11:52,240
involved with as well and there we went

330
00:11:55,190 --> 00:11:53,279
from there

331
00:11:57,030 --> 00:11:55,200
and that was the genesis of this project

332
00:12:00,470 --> 00:11:57,040
and

333
00:12:01,910 --> 00:12:00,480
yeah here we are no closer to the truth

334
00:12:02,470 --> 00:12:01,920
but well i guess maybe we are a little

335
00:12:04,069 --> 00:12:02,480
closer together

336
00:12:06,710 --> 00:12:04,079
i think we are a little closer to truth

337
00:12:08,150 --> 00:12:06,720
i i think we're um

338
00:12:09,990 --> 00:12:08,160
i think we're a little closer to the

339
00:12:13,190 --> 00:12:10,000
truth more than what people

340
00:12:15,829 --> 00:12:13,200
thought we ever would get to honestly

341
00:12:17,750 --> 00:12:15,839
um you know we're still getting a little

342
00:12:21,829 --> 00:12:17,760
pushback every once in a while i hear a

343
00:12:25,509 --> 00:12:23,910
so it's uh you know that's the way it's

344
00:12:27,910 --> 00:12:25,519
just gonna be so

345
00:12:28,870 --> 00:12:27,920
you know we knew it wasn't gonna be

346
00:12:30,790 --> 00:12:28,880
popular right

347
00:12:32,389 --> 00:12:30,800
i mean before the get-go we talked about

348
00:12:33,910 --> 00:12:32,399
this it wasn't gonna be popular people

349
00:12:35,430 --> 00:12:33,920
were gonna be upset

350
00:12:37,269 --> 00:12:35,440
but at some point you have to look at

351
00:12:38,389 --> 00:12:37,279
these cases and wonder why people don't

352
00:12:41,590 --> 00:12:38,399
touch them

353
00:12:42,550 --> 00:12:41,600
like what's the stigma with some of

354
00:12:44,470 --> 00:12:42,560
these cases

355
00:12:46,550 --> 00:12:44,480
and lon we're starting you and i

356
00:12:48,949 --> 00:12:46,560
particularly off air

357
00:12:51,030 --> 00:12:48,959
uh are starting to talk more about these

358
00:12:52,949 --> 00:12:51,040
uh alien abduction phenomena

359
00:12:54,230 --> 00:12:52,959
and uh it's definitely something that

360
00:12:55,269 --> 00:12:54,240
needs looked into a little further

361
00:12:57,030 --> 00:12:55,279
there's a lot of people out there

362
00:13:00,230 --> 00:12:57,040
investigating it

363
00:13:01,590 --> 00:13:00,240
uh it's just a very interesting part of

364
00:13:02,389 --> 00:13:01,600
the realm of the paranormal and the

365
00:13:04,550 --> 00:13:02,399
unexplained

366
00:13:06,870 --> 00:13:04,560
and it's just there's got to be a reason

367
00:13:07,590 --> 00:13:06,880
behind it right well i'll tell you i i

368
00:13:11,509 --> 00:13:07,600
think

369
00:13:14,790 --> 00:13:11,519
tonight's guess is probably

370
00:13:15,990 --> 00:13:14,800
uh a big aspect of that i think what he

371
00:13:19,509 --> 00:13:16,000
has gone through

372
00:13:20,310 --> 00:13:19,519
and what he has written about is really

373
00:13:23,509 --> 00:13:20,320
uh

374
00:13:27,269 --> 00:13:23,519
a real connection to what is going on

375
00:13:27,910 --> 00:13:27,279
um tonight's guest folks is a mike

376
00:13:30,870 --> 00:13:27,920
clelland

377
00:13:31,910 --> 00:13:30,880
mike uh uh is drawing an interesting

378
00:13:35,509 --> 00:13:31,920
parallel between

379
00:13:37,190 --> 00:13:35,519
owls and uh ufo alien abduction

380
00:13:38,310 --> 00:13:37,200
situations and

381
00:13:39,509 --> 00:13:38,320
it's gonna be an interesting show

382
00:13:40,870 --> 00:13:39,519
tonight so you're gonna want to stay

383
00:13:42,550 --> 00:13:40,880
tuned for the latter part of our show

384
00:13:44,310 --> 00:13:42,560
when we're talking to mike

385
00:13:45,670 --> 00:13:44,320
and really getting into this we're gonna

386
00:13:48,870 --> 00:13:45,680
be talking about his book

387
00:13:50,629 --> 00:13:48,880
the messengers and uh lon and i

388
00:13:52,069 --> 00:13:50,639
are using evernote now a great new

389
00:13:52,389 --> 00:13:52,079
product well not new product but new to

390
00:13:54,230 --> 00:13:52,399
us

391
00:13:55,509 --> 00:13:54,240
and collaborating on notes and lon's

392
00:13:57,430 --> 00:13:55,519
done his homework here

393
00:13:58,550 --> 00:13:57,440
as he does for every show and my mind is

394
00:14:01,590 --> 00:13:58,560
just kind of blown

395
00:14:02,790 --> 00:14:01,600
just reading through some of the notes

396
00:14:04,629 --> 00:14:02,800
here so i'm really interested in what

397
00:14:07,350 --> 00:14:04,639
mike's going to have to say tonight lon

398
00:14:09,509 --> 00:14:07,360
and i don't know and and are also our

399
00:14:12,310 --> 00:14:09,519
own experiences with

400
00:14:13,350 --> 00:14:12,320
you know these kind of situations yeah i

401
00:14:15,269 --> 00:14:13,360
think uh you know

402
00:14:16,790 --> 00:14:15,279
this al thing has been something that's

403
00:14:19,430 --> 00:14:16,800
been going on with me

404
00:14:21,030 --> 00:14:19,440
for a little over a year now and uh i've

405
00:14:23,910 --> 00:14:21,040
got my

406
00:14:25,430 --> 00:14:23,920
my theories as to why but i'm gonna ask

407
00:14:26,310 --> 00:14:25,440
i'm gonna ask mike see what he has to

408
00:14:28,790 --> 00:14:26,320
say about it i

409
00:14:29,670 --> 00:14:28,800
am it's it's just something that's

410
00:14:32,470 --> 00:14:29,680
happened to me

411
00:14:35,350 --> 00:14:32,480
it's i've known people i know people

412
00:14:38,310 --> 00:14:35,360
that the same thing has happened to them

413
00:14:40,310 --> 00:14:38,320
uh maybe we have found a connection

414
00:14:43,110 --> 00:14:40,320
somehow

415
00:14:45,030 --> 00:14:43,120
i don't know you know is it that owls

416
00:14:46,790 --> 00:14:45,040
are actually alien beings or are they

417
00:14:49,829 --> 00:14:46,800
controlled by alien beings or

418
00:14:51,670 --> 00:14:49,839
a higher intelligence you know the book

419
00:14:54,310 --> 00:14:51,680
is fantastic i will say that

420
00:14:55,030 --> 00:14:54,320
and mike is actually writing another one

421
00:14:57,750 --> 00:14:55,040
uh

422
00:15:00,150 --> 00:14:57,760
with i think i think the new one's going

423
00:15:03,189 --> 00:15:00,160
to have a lot of um

424
00:15:06,470 --> 00:15:03,199
a lot of stories from other people

425
00:15:09,030 --> 00:15:06,480
as opposed to just his and uh

426
00:15:11,110 --> 00:15:09,040
though this the messengers has a lot of

427
00:15:13,910 --> 00:15:11,120
other stories in there from other people

428
00:15:15,269 --> 00:15:13,920
it's uh very well written and uh yeah

429
00:15:18,389 --> 00:15:15,279
i'll tell you it's good it's a

430
00:15:18,790 --> 00:15:18,399
it's an amazing reference it really is i

431
00:15:22,470 --> 00:15:18,800
think

432
00:15:27,189 --> 00:15:22,480
one of the things that intrigues me uh

433
00:15:28,550 --> 00:15:27,199
is the concept of perhaps that these

434
00:15:33,670 --> 00:15:28,560
owls are really just

435
00:15:36,470 --> 00:15:33,680
supplanted imagery uh as a smoke screen

436
00:15:38,150 --> 00:15:36,480
of you know possible encounters with

437
00:15:40,710 --> 00:15:38,160
extraterrestrials long

438
00:15:41,269 --> 00:15:40,720
yeah yeah it's very interesting to me

439
00:15:43,189 --> 00:15:41,279
yeah

440
00:15:45,509 --> 00:15:43,199
didn't they have something about owls in

441
00:15:46,949 --> 00:15:45,519
the movie the fourth kind

442
00:15:48,949 --> 00:15:46,959
yeah there was like a scene in that

443
00:15:51,110 --> 00:15:48,959
movie about that and i i didn't think

444
00:15:52,629 --> 00:15:51,120
about it until i

445
00:15:54,710 --> 00:15:52,639
you know i watched a video there's if

446
00:15:56,389 --> 00:15:54,720
you google or you go to youtube and you

447
00:15:59,269 --> 00:15:56,399
type in mike clelland there's a

448
00:16:00,389 --> 00:15:59,279
art um a presentation he did over in

449
00:16:01,990 --> 00:16:00,399
great britain

450
00:16:03,590 --> 00:16:02,000
uh it was a really good presentation

451
00:16:04,949 --> 00:16:03,600
about kind of his background and getting

452
00:16:08,470 --> 00:16:04,959
into this

453
00:16:10,310 --> 00:16:08,480
and uh definitely worth the watch

454
00:16:11,509 --> 00:16:10,320
and it gives you his background and

455
00:16:13,269 --> 00:16:11,519
really why

456
00:16:14,389 --> 00:16:13,279
this is important to him and i just i'm

457
00:16:15,430 --> 00:16:14,399
not going to give too much more away

458
00:16:17,030 --> 00:16:15,440
about it because we do have a couple

459
00:16:18,550 --> 00:16:17,040
things to talk about

460
00:16:20,550 --> 00:16:18,560
and i think that we want to save the

461
00:16:22,310 --> 00:16:20,560
meat and potatoes for this

462
00:16:23,990 --> 00:16:22,320
when we talk to mike i don't want to

463
00:16:25,269 --> 00:16:24,000
step too far into it but there are some

464
00:16:26,310 --> 00:16:25,279
other things that have happened phantoms

465
00:16:28,230 --> 00:16:26,320
and monsters

466
00:16:29,749 --> 00:16:28,240
you've really been posting some articles

467
00:16:31,269 --> 00:16:29,759
you were busy this weekend maybe because

468
00:16:33,829 --> 00:16:31,279
you were snowed in

469
00:16:35,430 --> 00:16:33,839
yeah well that may be uh now there's a

470
00:16:38,470 --> 00:16:35,440
mothman

471
00:16:40,790 --> 00:16:38,480
uh story i promised last week

472
00:16:42,470 --> 00:16:40,800
so uh and i didn't get time to do it so

473
00:16:45,749 --> 00:16:42,480
i'm gonna do that real quickly here

474
00:16:49,269 --> 00:16:45,759
go ahead um

475
00:16:51,670 --> 00:16:49,279
this uh i got this from a lady

476
00:16:53,189 --> 00:16:51,680
in texas she said how long this story

477
00:16:55,110 --> 00:16:53,199
was told me recently while i was

478
00:16:57,590 --> 00:16:55,120
visiting my cousin val

479
00:16:58,470 --> 00:16:57,600
in dallas texas now val said that when

480
00:17:01,749 --> 00:16:58,480
she was

481
00:17:03,509 --> 00:17:01,759
only she has only told friends a story

482
00:17:06,150 --> 00:17:03,519
because she never knew

483
00:17:07,990 --> 00:17:06,160
what it was she saw she had been reading

484
00:17:09,829 --> 00:17:08,000
stories from witnesses of mothman and

485
00:17:11,909 --> 00:17:09,839
was starting to believe that's what

486
00:17:13,669 --> 00:17:11,919
she saw many years ago now val can't

487
00:17:16,309 --> 00:17:13,679
remember what year was

488
00:17:16,870 --> 00:17:16,319
only that it was in the mid-1920s which

489
00:17:19,909 --> 00:17:16,880
is probably

490
00:17:21,829 --> 00:17:19,919
seven or eight she's 24 now uh

491
00:17:24,309 --> 00:17:21,839
one at new val was at her grandmother's

492
00:17:27,029 --> 00:17:24,319
house near san antonio

493
00:17:29,990 --> 00:17:27,039
uh which is saying to us a hot area

494
00:17:31,990 --> 00:17:30,000
there in the south is really hot

495
00:17:34,150 --> 00:17:32,000
she had a lot of friends and family over

496
00:17:35,669 --> 00:17:34,160
for her aunt's baby shower

497
00:17:38,549 --> 00:17:35,679
all the kids were outside while the

498
00:17:41,110 --> 00:17:38,559
adults were inside doing their thing

499
00:17:43,190 --> 00:17:41,120
now one of the local kids val was

500
00:17:46,470 --> 00:17:43,200
playing with kept telling her about

501
00:17:47,750 --> 00:17:46,480
the monster that lived next door now she

502
00:17:50,230 --> 00:17:47,760
never wanted to greet

503
00:17:51,750 --> 00:17:50,240
great detail but val was drawn in anyway

504
00:17:54,150 --> 00:17:51,760
val went along and looked

505
00:17:55,750 --> 00:17:54,160
through a hole in the fence waiting to

506
00:17:57,750 --> 00:17:55,760
see something appear

507
00:17:59,669 --> 00:17:57,760
and this hole was in the fence was in

508
00:18:01,510 --> 00:17:59,679
the fence was behind the shed

509
00:18:03,350 --> 00:18:01,520
in the lower part of the yard so none of

510
00:18:05,669 --> 00:18:03,360
the other kids noticed them

511
00:18:06,630 --> 00:18:05,679
about 15 minutes later val remembers

512
00:18:10,070 --> 00:18:06,640
sensing

513
00:18:12,230 --> 00:18:10,080
a giant huge giant shadow

514
00:18:14,230 --> 00:18:12,240
come over her and hearing a swooshing

515
00:18:16,870 --> 00:18:14,240
sound as this huge creature

516
00:18:18,789 --> 00:18:16,880
landed on the other side of the fence as

517
00:18:19,110 --> 00:18:18,799
it landed it moved away from the fence

518
00:18:21,990 --> 00:18:19,120
and

519
00:18:22,950 --> 00:18:22,000
vowel lost sight of it now val said she

520
00:18:28,630 --> 00:18:22,960
was standing on

521
00:18:29,909 --> 00:18:28,640
a short light brown furrow and all over

522
00:18:32,630 --> 00:18:29,919
the body

523
00:18:33,909 --> 00:18:32,640
the nails were like talons and very long

524
00:18:36,470 --> 00:18:33,919
she was

525
00:18:37,190 --> 00:18:36,480
never able to see the face but it was

526
00:18:40,310 --> 00:18:37,200
tall with

527
00:18:41,510 --> 00:18:40,320
huge butterfly like wings a muscular

528
00:18:44,470 --> 00:18:41,520
human body

529
00:18:46,950 --> 00:18:44,480
long stout legs and made a swishing

530
00:18:49,190 --> 00:18:46,960
sound when it breathed

531
00:18:51,190 --> 00:18:49,200
she felt paralyzed at first but soon

532
00:18:53,270 --> 00:18:51,200
regained her ability to react

533
00:18:55,190 --> 00:18:53,280
quickly running inside and staring out

534
00:18:57,270 --> 00:18:55,200
the window in horror

535
00:18:58,310 --> 00:18:57,280
she said that she had never known what

536
00:19:02,230 --> 00:18:58,320
she saw but

537
00:19:04,070 --> 00:19:02,240
doesn't deny it may have been a mothman

538
00:19:06,470 --> 00:19:04,080
now thinking about it still scares her

539
00:19:08,390 --> 00:19:06,480
to this day she believes whatever it was

540
00:19:09,190 --> 00:19:08,400
naval believes whatever what she saw was

541
00:19:13,830 --> 00:19:09,200
real

542
00:19:17,270 --> 00:19:13,840
and uh i believe she did see a mothman

543
00:19:21,590 --> 00:19:19,029
if she really did see a mothman i don't

544
00:19:22,950 --> 00:19:21,600
know that's kind of unusual

545
00:19:25,190 --> 00:19:22,960
you know something like that out in the

546
00:19:28,710 --> 00:19:25,200
open but

547
00:19:32,310 --> 00:19:28,720
then again who knows i i tell you i

548
00:19:34,070 --> 00:19:32,320
um there's some strange stories come out

549
00:19:35,590 --> 00:19:34,080
of san antonio and the environs

550
00:19:37,990 --> 00:19:35,600
uh they're the whole way down to the

551
00:19:40,230 --> 00:19:38,000
border that's that south texas

552
00:19:43,270 --> 00:19:40,240
area has just gotten some really strange

553
00:19:46,549 --> 00:19:43,280
things i have talked about it for years

554
00:19:46,870 --> 00:19:46,559
uh of course people we know live down

555
00:19:48,070 --> 00:19:46,880
there

556
00:19:51,029 --> 00:19:48,080
have experienced a lot of different

557
00:19:54,710 --> 00:19:51,039
things as well uh one

558
00:19:57,990 --> 00:19:54,720
would be uh be ken gerhart

559
00:20:01,029 --> 00:19:58,000
and and another would be uh uh well

560
00:20:02,549 --> 00:20:01,039
blackburn as well so i it it is a

561
00:20:06,070 --> 00:20:02,559
strange area and there's a lot of

562
00:20:10,789 --> 00:20:06,080
weird things that go on down there

563
00:20:15,669 --> 00:20:10,799
uh this week and actually today

564
00:20:22,310 --> 00:20:20,870
odd account uh hi mr strickler

565
00:20:24,470 --> 00:20:22,320
i have really enjoyed your fans of

566
00:20:26,310 --> 00:20:24,480
monsters e-books and blog the last few

567
00:20:27,430 --> 00:20:26,320
years i just finished the most recent

568
00:20:29,909 --> 00:20:27,440
book

569
00:20:32,070 --> 00:20:29,919
which had a number of dog and wolf

570
00:20:33,669 --> 00:20:32,080
humanoid encounters

571
00:20:35,669 --> 00:20:33,679
i like reading these encounters because

572
00:20:37,669 --> 00:20:35,679
it makes me feel better to know

573
00:20:39,029 --> 00:20:37,679
that there are others out there who have

574
00:20:42,149 --> 00:20:39,039
had encounters

575
00:20:44,470 --> 00:20:42,159
with something that they can't explain

576
00:20:46,390 --> 00:20:44,480
now i decided that i would send you my

577
00:20:47,590 --> 00:20:46,400
weirdest story which happened to me as a

578
00:20:50,070 --> 00:20:47,600
child

579
00:20:51,110 --> 00:20:50,080
i have seen and felt strange things

580
00:20:52,870 --> 00:20:51,120
since then

581
00:20:55,110 --> 00:20:52,880
but this encounter was both the

582
00:20:57,590 --> 00:20:55,120
strangest thing that i have ever

583
00:20:59,430 --> 00:20:57,600
has ever happened to me and i believe a

584
00:21:00,470 --> 00:20:59,440
catalyst for other unusual things in my

585
00:21:03,430 --> 00:21:00,480
life and an interest

586
00:21:04,549 --> 00:21:03,440
in them several years ago i sent an

587
00:21:06,630 --> 00:21:04,559
encounter

588
00:21:07,990 --> 00:21:06,640
to another well-known researcher but i

589
00:21:11,350 --> 00:21:08,000
never heard back

590
00:21:14,470 --> 00:21:11,360
i'm not surprised as it is pretty odd

591
00:21:14,950 --> 00:21:14,480
and seems made up but it did happen what

592
00:21:18,950 --> 00:21:14,960
it was

593
00:21:20,870 --> 00:21:18,960
i had no idea when i was a little girl

594
00:21:23,350 --> 00:21:20,880
my paw paw

595
00:21:26,630 --> 00:21:23,360
lived in an old farmhouse in the upper

596
00:21:29,430 --> 00:21:26,640
end of cleveland county north carolina

597
00:21:30,390 --> 00:21:29,440
we used used to go visit with him every

598
00:21:32,630 --> 00:21:30,400
saturday

599
00:21:33,510 --> 00:21:32,640
my dad my mom my baby brother and i

600
00:21:35,590 --> 00:21:33,520
along with

601
00:21:36,630 --> 00:21:35,600
usually several other my dad's brothers

602
00:21:37,990 --> 00:21:36,640
and sisters

603
00:21:41,590 --> 00:21:38,000
and their assorted children were

604
00:21:44,070 --> 00:21:41,600
congregated after lunch at papa's

605
00:21:46,070 --> 00:21:44,080
us cousins would play together outside

606
00:21:48,070 --> 00:21:46,080
and out in the woods

607
00:21:50,149 --> 00:21:48,080
which ran behind papa's farm and

608
00:21:51,430 --> 00:21:50,159
stretched for probably 10 miles to a

609
00:21:53,430 --> 00:21:51,440
dirt road

610
00:21:55,510 --> 00:21:53,440
beyond which was an apple orchard in a

611
00:21:58,630 --> 00:21:55,520
cattle pasture

612
00:22:00,789 --> 00:21:58,640
this was early 80s in a rural area back

613
00:22:02,230 --> 00:22:00,799
when kids could take care take off in

614
00:22:05,669 --> 00:22:02,240
the woods for hours and then be

615
00:22:07,830 --> 00:22:05,679
okay we would all have dinner together

616
00:22:11,029 --> 00:22:07,840
and then hang out until bedtime for us

617
00:22:14,549 --> 00:22:11,039
kids when we all head home

618
00:22:17,590 --> 00:22:14,559
at the time i had just turned eight

619
00:22:19,830 --> 00:22:17,600
my cousin jay was six

620
00:22:22,549 --> 00:22:19,840
my brother and jade's sister were both

621
00:22:24,950 --> 00:22:22,559
small toddlers barry walking

622
00:22:26,710 --> 00:22:24,960
the night in question jay and i and our

623
00:22:29,029 --> 00:22:26,720
other siblings were the only kids

624
00:22:31,669 --> 00:22:29,039
present at paw paws

625
00:22:32,710 --> 00:22:31,679
he and i would spend the day playing in

626
00:22:34,950 --> 00:22:32,720
the woods as usual

627
00:22:35,830 --> 00:22:34,960
and out in the yard where i was trying

628
00:22:37,830 --> 00:22:35,840
out his

629
00:22:40,230 --> 00:22:37,840
prize where jay was trying to surprise a

630
00:22:42,789 --> 00:22:40,240
brand new skateboard

631
00:22:44,710 --> 00:22:42,799
after supper we hung out in the back

632
00:22:45,430 --> 00:22:44,720
bedroom watching tv until our parents to

633
00:22:49,190 --> 00:22:45,440
form us

634
00:22:51,909 --> 00:22:49,200
it was time to go home now papa's house

635
00:22:52,630 --> 00:22:51,919
had a glaston porch was also served as a

636
00:22:55,990 --> 00:22:52,640
laundry room

637
00:22:58,630 --> 00:22:56,000
on the front right outside the kitchen

638
00:23:00,950 --> 00:22:58,640
this porch because of the way the lot

639
00:23:02,630 --> 00:23:00,960
was laid out and the house was built

640
00:23:04,630 --> 00:23:02,640
was fairly tall and looking out the

641
00:23:06,830 --> 00:23:04,640
windows gave you a panoramic

642
00:23:08,070 --> 00:23:06,840
and slightly elevated view of the

643
00:23:10,390 --> 00:23:08,080
backyard

644
00:23:12,549 --> 00:23:10,400
i would speculate that the porch windows

645
00:23:14,230 --> 00:23:12,559
were about 20 feet off the ground

646
00:23:17,590 --> 00:23:14,240
and the backyard sloped away from the

647
00:23:17,990 --> 00:23:17,600
porch the backyard was lit by two large

648
00:23:20,390 --> 00:23:18,000
lights

649
00:23:21,990 --> 00:23:20,400
one of which was mounted on a pole to

650
00:23:24,789 --> 00:23:22,000
the left of the yard the other mounted

651
00:23:26,549 --> 00:23:24,799
on the side of pawpaw's shop which is to

652
00:23:29,270 --> 00:23:26,559
the right

653
00:23:29,909 --> 00:23:29,280
they were very bright and each light lit

654
00:23:32,870 --> 00:23:29,919
up

655
00:23:35,270 --> 00:23:32,880
a fairly large area the only real

656
00:23:37,669 --> 00:23:35,280
shadowy part of the backyard

657
00:23:39,510 --> 00:23:37,679
was an area where a large tree stood

658
00:23:40,149 --> 00:23:39,520
casting a shadow that fell between the

659
00:23:42,070 --> 00:23:40,159
shop

660
00:23:44,070 --> 00:23:42,080
and the greenhouse which was the far

661
00:23:47,029 --> 00:23:44,080
left the yard

662
00:23:48,710 --> 00:23:47,039
it was under his this tree that jay had

663
00:23:51,590 --> 00:23:48,720
left his skateboard

664
00:23:53,110 --> 00:23:51,600
when we stopped playing to eat when we

665
00:23:54,870 --> 00:23:53,120
stopped playing eat supper

666
00:23:56,149 --> 00:23:54,880
and he and i decided that we should go

667
00:23:57,830 --> 00:23:56,159
out

668
00:23:59,350 --> 00:23:57,840
and get it while our parents were still

669
00:24:02,789 --> 00:23:59,360
saying their goodbyes

670
00:24:04,549 --> 00:24:02,799
in the kitchen well the wolf man was in

671
00:24:06,630 --> 00:24:04,559
the backyard

672
00:24:08,070 --> 00:24:06,640
we saw him at the same time as soon as

673
00:24:10,470 --> 00:24:08,080
we entered the porch

674
00:24:13,269 --> 00:24:10,480
he was man-sized and looked exactly like

675
00:24:17,190 --> 00:24:13,279
a werewolf from a bad bee movement

676
00:24:19,430 --> 00:24:17,200
he had a shaggy dark brown wolf man head

677
00:24:21,430 --> 00:24:19,440
with long-pointed ears and a lighter

678
00:24:23,750 --> 00:24:21,440
brown muzzle

679
00:24:24,710 --> 00:24:23,760
his hands were human-like as best as i

680
00:24:26,950 --> 00:24:24,720
can remember

681
00:24:28,789 --> 00:24:26,960
though they were covered in dark fur and

682
00:24:31,669 --> 00:24:28,799
he had long claws

683
00:24:32,789 --> 00:24:31,679
he was wearing a red and black checkered

684
00:24:35,830 --> 00:24:32,799
flannel shirt

685
00:24:38,230 --> 00:24:35,840
and blue jeans i don't remember anything

686
00:24:41,029 --> 00:24:38,240
about his feet whether he had

687
00:24:43,029 --> 00:24:41,039
uh shoes or claws but his legs were

688
00:24:45,110 --> 00:24:43,039
straight like a person not that backward

689
00:24:47,029 --> 00:24:45,120
like a dog

690
00:24:49,909 --> 00:24:47,039
he was walking back and forth and yard

691
00:24:52,630 --> 00:24:49,919
almost robot like as if he won the track

692
00:24:53,269 --> 00:24:52,640
i can't really describe it well it was

693
00:24:55,430 --> 00:24:53,279
like his

694
00:24:57,750 --> 00:24:55,440
legs were moving a little but not enough

695
00:25:00,549 --> 00:24:57,760
to actually count as walking

696
00:25:02,870 --> 00:25:00,559
it was more like he was gliding but in a

697
00:25:05,430 --> 00:25:02,880
jerky way his body

698
00:25:06,950 --> 00:25:05,440
was human in proportion he would move

699
00:25:08,310 --> 00:25:06,960
from edge to the light near the

700
00:25:10,470 --> 00:25:08,320
greenhouse across to the

701
00:25:11,510 --> 00:25:10,480
light near the shop stopping when he

702
00:25:13,909 --> 00:25:11,520
reached and ended

703
00:25:16,310 --> 00:25:13,919
the end an illuminated area and turn

704
00:25:17,510 --> 00:25:16,320
around a strange jerky way and gliding

705
00:25:21,430 --> 00:25:17,520
back

706
00:25:25,750 --> 00:25:21,440
his eyes were red and glued some

707
00:25:27,669 --> 00:25:25,760
um like like one of those laser lights

708
00:25:29,190 --> 00:25:27,679
that you used to tease cats

709
00:25:31,830 --> 00:25:29,200
that calling about the level of

710
00:25:32,710 --> 00:25:31,840
brightness the only time he was out of

711
00:25:35,350 --> 00:25:32,720
our sight

712
00:25:36,630 --> 00:25:35,360
was when he passed into the shadow area

713
00:25:38,390 --> 00:25:36,640
of the tree

714
00:25:39,909 --> 00:25:38,400
he seemed to be showing off for us

715
00:25:42,390 --> 00:25:39,919
wanting us to see him

716
00:25:43,909 --> 00:25:42,400
or at least that he was that's what it

717
00:25:46,310 --> 00:25:43,919
felt like

718
00:25:48,630 --> 00:25:46,320
the feeling that he carried with him was

719
00:25:51,029 --> 00:25:48,640
of overwhelming benevolence

720
00:25:51,830 --> 00:25:51,039
i felt like he knew we were there and

721
00:25:54,070 --> 00:25:51,840
could see us

722
00:25:55,590 --> 00:25:54,080
watching and feel that we were afraid

723
00:25:58,710 --> 00:25:55,600
and he was glad

724
00:26:01,110 --> 00:25:58,720
not sure if that makes any sense but

725
00:26:02,070 --> 00:26:01,120
it is what i felt at the time dreading

726
00:26:05,110 --> 00:26:02,080
fear and like

727
00:26:07,190 --> 00:26:05,120
he was aware of us and uh doing what he

728
00:26:08,789 --> 00:26:07,200
was doing on the purpose of scare us

729
00:26:10,789 --> 00:26:08,799
now of course we freaked out started

730
00:26:13,110 --> 00:26:10,799
screaming for her parents

731
00:26:15,510 --> 00:26:13,120
and of course once they rushed down into

732
00:26:17,430 --> 00:26:15,520
the porch only to hear us hysterical

733
00:26:19,110 --> 00:26:17,440
because the wolf man was in backyard

734
00:26:21,190 --> 00:26:19,120
they say the usual

735
00:26:24,390 --> 00:26:21,200
parent thing about overactive

736
00:26:27,430 --> 00:26:24,400
imagination too much scooby-doo

737
00:26:29,750 --> 00:26:27,440
well because even though he

738
00:26:30,789 --> 00:26:29,760
was there walking back and forth and in

739
00:26:32,390 --> 00:26:30,799
front of them

740
00:26:35,669 --> 00:26:32,400
and we were the only ones you could see

741
00:26:37,590 --> 00:26:35,679
him none of the adults goods

742
00:26:39,350 --> 00:26:37,600
i remember pointing and saying it's out

743
00:26:41,029 --> 00:26:39,360
there and being really frustrated

744
00:26:43,510 --> 00:26:41,039
because they couldn't see it

745
00:26:45,350 --> 00:26:43,520
finally my dad determined to put an end

746
00:26:47,430 --> 00:26:45,360
to the nonsense announce he was going

747
00:26:49,750 --> 00:26:47,440
out in the yard and get jay's

748
00:26:51,430 --> 00:26:49,760
skateboard from another tree we tried to

749
00:26:52,950 --> 00:26:51,440
stop him but it went anyway

750
00:26:55,029 --> 00:26:52,960
at that time the wolf man was still

751
00:26:57,350 --> 00:26:55,039
doing his strange gliding back and forth

752
00:26:58,870 --> 00:26:57,360
when my dad opened the door porch door

753
00:27:00,950 --> 00:26:58,880
and hit the steps

754
00:27:02,549 --> 00:27:00,960
that led to the porch to the yard he

755
00:27:05,029 --> 00:27:02,559
triggered ascension

756
00:27:06,470 --> 00:27:05,039
motion sensor light which was on the

757
00:27:08,950 --> 00:27:06,480
corner of the porch awning

758
00:27:10,549 --> 00:27:08,960
lighting up the shadowed area of the air

759
00:27:12,310 --> 00:27:10,559
on the shattered tree area

760
00:27:14,470 --> 00:27:12,320
just before this happened the wolf man

761
00:27:17,029 --> 00:27:14,480
had stepped into the shadowy area and

762
00:27:18,710 --> 00:27:17,039
disappeared from the view in the dark

763
00:27:21,430 --> 00:27:18,720
when the light came on lighting up the

764
00:27:24,950 --> 00:27:21,440
tree area the wall damage is gone

765
00:27:29,510 --> 00:27:27,430
for time i'm just gonna keep on i'm

766
00:27:31,909 --> 00:27:29,520
gonna skip a little bit here

767
00:27:33,909 --> 00:27:31,919
uh years past but i've always wondered

768
00:27:36,389 --> 00:27:33,919
about what we saw that night now my

769
00:27:38,710 --> 00:27:36,399
cousin jay forgot about it all together

770
00:27:41,269 --> 00:27:38,720
i asked him about it just a few months

771
00:27:43,029 --> 00:27:41,279
ago and he didn't remember at all

772
00:27:44,950 --> 00:27:43,039
what really brought it back to my memory

773
00:27:46,149 --> 00:27:44,960
was the story in linda godfrey's real

774
00:27:48,070 --> 00:27:46,159
wolfman

775
00:27:50,389 --> 00:27:48,080
about the girl who saw the hitchhiking

776
00:27:52,230 --> 00:27:50,399
werewolf wearing clothes before that

777
00:27:54,070 --> 00:27:52,240
i never seen a serious report of a

778
00:27:56,070 --> 00:27:54,080
canine or lupine

779
00:27:57,190 --> 00:27:56,080
humanoid wearing clothes in any

780
00:27:59,029 --> 00:27:57,200
publication

781
00:28:00,870 --> 00:27:59,039
i don't often tell anyone about the wolf

782
00:28:02,630 --> 00:28:00,880
man we saw because the sounds are

783
00:28:05,909 --> 00:28:02,640
completely crazy of course

784
00:28:09,110 --> 00:28:05,919
my parents and uh jay's parents never

785
00:28:10,710 --> 00:28:09,120
for one second believed it so she goes

786
00:28:12,710 --> 00:28:10,720
into some

787
00:28:14,230 --> 00:28:12,720
you know indian lore and a few other

788
00:28:17,110 --> 00:28:14,240
things that happen

789
00:28:17,430 --> 00:28:17,120
in the area and maybe that might be uh

790
00:28:20,149 --> 00:28:17,440
what

791
00:28:21,110 --> 00:28:20,159
happened but she said i appreciate you

792
00:28:23,669 --> 00:28:21,120
taking the time

793
00:28:25,750 --> 00:28:23,679
to read this uh we really enjoy your

794
00:28:28,950 --> 00:28:25,760
work good luck with your research

795
00:28:32,310 --> 00:28:28,960
kh well she wanted an answer

796
00:28:34,789 --> 00:28:32,320
i'll tell you as we know this entire

797
00:28:35,750 --> 00:28:34,799
upright canine phenomenon is truly an

798
00:28:38,950 --> 00:28:35,760
enigma

799
00:28:40,470 --> 00:28:38,960
not unlike bigfoot and

800
00:28:42,230 --> 00:28:40,480
you know i do believe they're flesh and

801
00:28:44,549 --> 00:28:42,240
blood bipedal canines

802
00:28:47,510 --> 00:28:44,559
within our existence i also believe that

803
00:28:50,950 --> 00:28:47,520
there may be a supernatural aspect

804
00:28:52,549 --> 00:28:50,960
to any of these beings but

805
00:28:54,470 --> 00:28:52,559
there are just too many eyewitnesses

806
00:28:57,029 --> 00:28:54,480
with varied descriptions

807
00:28:59,909 --> 00:28:57,039
though anecdotal to discount any degree

808
00:29:04,789 --> 00:29:02,630
i wonder if this wolf man may have been

809
00:29:07,430 --> 00:29:04,799
a zoo for manifestation

810
00:29:10,389 --> 00:29:07,440
uh it's possible but i don't think it's

811
00:29:14,950 --> 00:29:12,789
this is why we investigate in order to

812
00:29:19,430 --> 00:29:14,960
hone the conclusions

813
00:29:21,669 --> 00:29:19,440
as to what people are encountering so um

814
00:29:24,149 --> 00:29:21,679
there may never be definitive answers

815
00:29:26,230 --> 00:29:24,159
but we keep looking for the truth and

816
00:29:28,310 --> 00:29:26,240
that's why we keep doing it so if you've

817
00:29:30,149 --> 00:29:28,320
got any type of uh

818
00:29:31,909 --> 00:29:30,159
scenario or any type of account that you

819
00:29:35,350 --> 00:29:31,919
want to send to me just feel free to do

820
00:29:40,789 --> 00:29:38,389
all part of the collecting yeah

821
00:29:43,190 --> 00:29:40,799
we need to get more stories of these

822
00:29:47,350 --> 00:29:43,200
wolf man dog man

823
00:29:49,110 --> 00:29:47,360
type creatures lon yes we do

824
00:29:51,350 --> 00:29:49,120
we definitely have to have some sort of

825
00:29:55,269 --> 00:29:51,360
uh uh

826
00:29:57,750 --> 00:29:55,279
like a treasure chest full of these uh

827
00:29:59,029 --> 00:29:57,760
these encounters but talk about a little

828
00:30:00,149 --> 00:29:59,039
bit about our guests before i bring them

829
00:30:01,750 --> 00:30:00,159
out here because mike's actually

830
00:30:05,350 --> 00:30:01,760
standing by

831
00:30:07,909 --> 00:30:05,360
okay mike

832
00:30:09,430 --> 00:30:07,919
again is the author of the messengers

833
00:30:11,350 --> 00:30:09,440
and he's just got an

834
00:30:12,549 --> 00:30:11,360
excellent backstory so like i said we're

835
00:30:15,110 --> 00:30:12,559
not going to ruin too much

836
00:30:16,789 --> 00:30:15,120
of the show for you in fact i think i'm

837
00:30:18,950 --> 00:30:16,799
just going to bring them on right now on

838
00:30:20,230 --> 00:30:18,960
um we'll take a break here real fast and

839
00:30:22,230 --> 00:30:20,240
then we'll bring them on

840
00:30:23,669 --> 00:30:22,240
so stay tuned folks no musical interlude

841
00:30:25,990 --> 00:30:23,679
because i don't want to get sued

842
00:30:27,590 --> 00:30:26,000
so smoke them if you got them take this

843
00:30:30,389 --> 00:30:27,600
time to go and uh

844
00:30:35,350 --> 00:30:30,399
get yourself a snack and uh we'll be

845
00:30:39,190 --> 00:30:38,310
we're back arcane radio sean forker lon

846
00:30:41,750 --> 00:30:39,200
strickler

847
00:30:43,190 --> 00:30:41,760
and our guest tonight mike mcclellan

848
00:30:44,389 --> 00:30:43,200
mike thanks for joining us here on

849
00:30:46,950 --> 00:30:44,399
arcane radio

850
00:30:48,549 --> 00:30:46,960
lon and i are so incredibly so

851
00:30:51,350 --> 00:30:48,559
incredibly excited

852
00:30:52,950 --> 00:30:51,360
to listen to you and hear about these uh

853
00:30:56,549 --> 00:30:52,960
stories with the owls

854
00:30:58,789 --> 00:30:56,559
and lon take it away well mike

855
00:31:00,149 --> 00:30:58,799
thanks for joining us i uh i got your

856
00:31:02,630 --> 00:31:00,159
book as soon as it came out

857
00:31:04,310 --> 00:31:02,640
quite frankly i was uh this is something

858
00:31:06,389 --> 00:31:04,320
that i've been doing with as well

859
00:31:07,509 --> 00:31:06,399
so i'm going to have a few questions for

860
00:31:14,230 --> 00:31:07,519
you

861
00:31:17,990 --> 00:31:14,240
counter and what just

862
00:31:19,029 --> 00:31:18,000
what transpired uh shortly afterwards so

863
00:31:20,630 --> 00:31:19,039
you when you say the first i'll

864
00:31:21,750 --> 00:31:20,640
encounter you're talking about the story

865
00:31:23,909 --> 00:31:21,760
that opens the book

866
00:31:24,950 --> 00:31:23,919
yeah you and kristen yeah you know i had

867
00:31:27,430 --> 00:31:24,960
a few uh

868
00:31:29,350 --> 00:31:27,440
other smaller owl events actually in

869
00:31:31,029 --> 00:31:29,360
that same area curiously enough but

870
00:31:32,230 --> 00:31:31,039
those were just that was years before

871
00:31:34,149 --> 00:31:32,240
that event and

872
00:31:35,830 --> 00:31:34,159
um it was just you know walking down

873
00:31:37,750 --> 00:31:35,840
that trail i felt like i was followed by

874
00:31:42,310 --> 00:31:37,760
an owl or a couple owls

875
00:31:44,310 --> 00:31:42,320
um so that uh that story with kristen

876
00:31:46,149 --> 00:31:44,320
this was someone that i had worked with

877
00:31:47,990 --> 00:31:46,159
uh i didn't know her very well and

878
00:31:50,470 --> 00:31:48,000
and this was i lived in a town where i

879
00:31:53,190 --> 00:31:50,480
was working for an outdoor school doing

880
00:31:54,789 --> 00:31:53,200
uh you know teaching camping and such so

881
00:31:56,630 --> 00:31:54,799
i had been gone all summer and i

882
00:31:58,630 --> 00:31:56,640
just got back to the hometown i was

883
00:31:59,590 --> 00:31:58,640
living in which is right near jackson

884
00:32:01,909 --> 00:31:59,600
hole wyoming

885
00:32:03,350 --> 00:32:01,919
so right in the shadow of grand teton

886
00:32:06,950 --> 00:32:03,360
national park

887
00:32:08,389 --> 00:32:06,960
and um i was talking about camping and

888
00:32:09,590 --> 00:32:08,399
she said she hadn't camped at all that

889
00:32:11,509 --> 00:32:09,600
summer and i said oh we should go

890
00:32:14,070 --> 00:32:11,519
camping and she said okay and so

891
00:32:14,710 --> 00:32:14,080
a few days later we hiked into the woods

892
00:32:17,750 --> 00:32:14,720
and uh

893
00:32:19,029 --> 00:32:17,760
we i went with um well very little on

894
00:32:21,830 --> 00:32:19,039
our backs you know so it was a

895
00:32:23,269 --> 00:32:21,840
pleasant night and just one night and so

896
00:32:24,470 --> 00:32:23,279
given the weather conditions and such

897
00:32:26,070 --> 00:32:24,480
there was no reason for

898
00:32:27,509 --> 00:32:26,080
a shelter so we just slept out under the

899
00:32:29,269 --> 00:32:27,519
stars but there came a point when we

900
00:32:31,509 --> 00:32:29,279
were talking

901
00:32:32,630 --> 00:32:31,519
when i realized that this is somewhat

902
00:32:34,789 --> 00:32:32,640
this was

903
00:32:35,909 --> 00:32:34,799
in essence a stranger really and there

904
00:32:37,029 --> 00:32:35,919
came a point where we were talking that

905
00:32:39,590 --> 00:32:37,039
i was like well this

906
00:32:41,430 --> 00:32:39,600
is really incredible this is someone

907
00:32:44,149 --> 00:32:41,440
this is i'm impressed

908
00:32:47,110 --> 00:32:44,159
and it was at that moment that uh an owl

909
00:32:49,350 --> 00:32:47,120
flew over us this was at sunset

910
00:32:50,549 --> 00:32:49,360
and then another owl and then a third

911
00:32:53,909 --> 00:32:50,559
owl

912
00:32:56,950 --> 00:32:53,919
and for the next well over an

913
00:32:58,310 --> 00:32:56,960
hour you know the sun set we laid our

914
00:33:01,430 --> 00:32:58,320
sleeping bags out and

915
00:33:01,990 --> 00:33:01,440
this entire time these owls were flying

916
00:33:03,830 --> 00:33:02,000
around us

917
00:33:05,669 --> 00:33:03,840
landing near us landing on branches near

918
00:33:06,950 --> 00:33:05,679
us and they would swoop down we'd lie

919
00:33:08,870 --> 00:33:06,960
right on our backs and look up at the

920
00:33:10,870 --> 00:33:08,880
stars on our in our sleeping bags and

921
00:33:13,909 --> 00:33:10,880
and the owls would like blot out the

922
00:33:16,870 --> 00:33:13,919
stars for just one second

923
00:33:18,310 --> 00:33:16,880
so jump ahead to uh uh four days later

924
00:33:20,549 --> 00:33:18,320
you know what happened one night and

925
00:33:22,549 --> 00:33:20,559
i said to her afterwards i said wow you

926
00:33:24,070 --> 00:33:22,559
know if i go camping again which i might

927
00:33:25,350 --> 00:33:24,080
i'll give you a call she said great so i

928
00:33:27,350 --> 00:33:25,360
called her a few days later and said

929
00:33:31,029 --> 00:33:27,360
let's go and she set up wonderful

930
00:33:32,389 --> 00:33:31,039
so we went camping four days after that

931
00:33:35,509 --> 00:33:32,399
initial owl event

932
00:33:37,269 --> 00:33:35,519
and the same thing happened we was sun

933
00:33:38,870 --> 00:33:37,279
was setting and this owl landed on a

934
00:33:41,029 --> 00:33:38,880
branch near us and another i'll

935
00:33:41,990 --> 00:33:41,039
landed on the ground near us and then

936
00:33:44,470 --> 00:33:42,000
you know for the next

937
00:33:45,269 --> 00:33:44,480
uh probably less time probably 45

938
00:33:48,230 --> 00:33:45,279
minutes

939
00:33:49,590 --> 00:33:48,240
uh these owls flew around us and they

940
00:33:52,630 --> 00:33:49,600
landed close like

941
00:33:54,310 --> 00:33:52,640
really really close to us like really

942
00:33:57,990 --> 00:33:54,320
strange

943
00:34:01,350 --> 00:33:58,000
and uh and that

944
00:34:02,789 --> 00:34:01,360
event happened once was pretty cool it

945
00:34:03,669 --> 00:34:02,799
was pretty neat to see the owls close up

946
00:34:06,310 --> 00:34:03,679
like that

947
00:34:07,509 --> 00:34:06,320
but to have it happen four days later

948
00:34:08,470 --> 00:34:07,519
and now i'm this is we're in a

949
00:34:09,589 --> 00:34:08,480
completely different part of the

950
00:34:11,750 --> 00:34:09,599
mountains but

951
00:34:14,629 --> 00:34:11,760
you know it wasn't that far away and i'm

952
00:34:17,990 --> 00:34:14,639
convinced it was the same three owls

953
00:34:19,829 --> 00:34:18,000
and it was positively

954
00:34:22,230 --> 00:34:19,839
mystical to have it happen a second time

955
00:34:24,550 --> 00:34:22,240
and it really kind of knocked me off

956
00:34:25,750 --> 00:34:24,560
kilter in a way and i just got

957
00:34:27,990 --> 00:34:25,760
completely like

958
00:34:30,550 --> 00:34:28,000
obsessed and and and just trying to

959
00:34:32,470 --> 00:34:30,560
figure out this owl thing and

960
00:34:33,909 --> 00:34:32,480
you know looking up all totems and one

961
00:34:34,950 --> 00:34:33,919
of the things that happened to me after

962
00:34:38,550 --> 00:34:34,960
that is i pretty much

963
00:34:39,109 --> 00:34:38,560
would ask anyone with outdoor experience

964
00:34:41,030 --> 00:34:39,119
and then

965
00:34:42,149 --> 00:34:41,040
people with with ufo experience people

966
00:34:44,069 --> 00:34:42,159
who senior foes

967
00:34:46,710 --> 00:34:44,079
i would ask the same question have you

968
00:34:49,030 --> 00:34:46,720
ever had any odd experiences with owls

969
00:34:50,389 --> 00:34:49,040
and i was shocked at how many people

970
00:34:51,990 --> 00:34:50,399
would have these weird

971
00:34:54,550 --> 00:34:52,000
stories and i mean when you get right

972
00:34:57,829 --> 00:34:54,560
down to it but the story i just told

973
00:34:59,829 --> 00:34:57,839
isn't that strange but

974
00:35:01,030 --> 00:34:59,839
but it had an impact on me right the

975
00:35:02,390 --> 00:35:01,040
story itself is like

976
00:35:05,270 --> 00:35:02,400
some you know so i saw a bunch of novels

977
00:35:08,230 --> 00:35:05,280
so what but the what happened was it had

978
00:35:09,829 --> 00:35:08,240
a really profound impact on the way i

979
00:35:10,950 --> 00:35:09,839
basically the way i lived my life and it

980
00:35:12,150 --> 00:35:10,960
changed my life around

981
00:35:14,150 --> 00:35:12,160
one of the things that happened is i

982
00:35:16,710 --> 00:35:14,160
wrote up that story

983
00:35:18,069 --> 00:35:16,720
uh like like a diary entry and it was

984
00:35:19,829 --> 00:35:18,079
one of the first stories i put on my

985
00:35:21,589 --> 00:35:19,839
blog so this happened event this event

986
00:35:22,870 --> 00:35:21,599
happened in 2006

987
00:35:25,270 --> 00:35:22,880
that was three years later that i

988
00:35:26,950 --> 00:35:25,280
started my blog 2009

989
00:35:28,710 --> 00:35:26,960
and that was one of the first stories

990
00:35:32,630 --> 00:35:28,720
that i put up

991
00:35:34,710 --> 00:35:32,640
and uh the uh the thing that was

992
00:35:36,069 --> 00:35:34,720
so so after the story we went up online

993
00:35:37,349 --> 00:35:36,079
i got a hold of kristen i hadn't talked

994
00:35:38,069 --> 00:35:37,359
to her in a while but we were still

995
00:35:39,829 --> 00:35:38,079
friends

996
00:35:41,349 --> 00:35:39,839
and i said um listen do you remember

997
00:35:44,470 --> 00:35:41,359
what we were talking about

998
00:35:45,990 --> 00:35:44,480
the very first night when we first saw

999
00:35:47,030 --> 00:35:46,000
those owls because i remember thinking

1000
00:35:50,230 --> 00:35:47,040
at the time like

1001
00:35:51,750 --> 00:35:50,240
this is something this is intense and uh

1002
00:35:53,030 --> 00:35:51,760
and she said oh i remember exactly what

1003
00:35:54,470 --> 00:35:53,040
i was thinking about she said i was

1004
00:35:57,589 --> 00:35:54,480
giving my most heartfelt

1005
00:35:58,150 --> 00:35:57,599
definition of what god meant to me and

1006
00:36:01,109 --> 00:35:58,160
that

1007
00:36:03,349 --> 00:36:01,119
really sort of threw me for a loop so

1008
00:36:06,470 --> 00:36:03,359
this already

1009
00:36:08,950 --> 00:36:06,480
intense account just got that much more

1010
00:36:10,870 --> 00:36:08,960
intense and and it has i have to say it

1011
00:36:14,470 --> 00:36:10,880
has remained intense over these

1012
00:36:16,150 --> 00:36:14,480
you know now a decade later it's 2016

1013
00:36:16,710 --> 00:36:16,160
now so this has been 10 years later yeah

1014
00:36:17,829 --> 00:36:16,720
and so in

1015
00:36:21,910 --> 00:36:17,839
that 10 years i've done a lot of

1016
00:36:24,390 --> 00:36:21,920
research and collected a lot of stories

1017
00:36:25,430 --> 00:36:24,400
well there was a there was an incident

1018
00:36:27,430 --> 00:36:25,440
not that long

1019
00:36:29,270 --> 00:36:27,440
after that incident where you sold five

1020
00:36:31,270 --> 00:36:29,280
houses of nitro

1021
00:36:32,550 --> 00:36:31,280
that's correct yeah that was actually uh

1022
00:36:34,550 --> 00:36:32,560
so well actually that would have been

1023
00:36:36,870 --> 00:36:34,560
2009 that would have been in the autumn

1024
00:36:37,510 --> 00:36:36,880
or probably august late august of 2009 i

1025
00:36:38,710 --> 00:36:37,520
could figure

1026
00:36:39,829 --> 00:36:38,720
look it up exactly i was with a friend

1027
00:36:41,270 --> 00:36:39,839
of mine peter and we were in the

1028
00:36:42,870 --> 00:36:41,280
mountains and i was teaching for an

1029
00:36:46,310 --> 00:36:42,880
outdoor school again

1030
00:36:48,230 --> 00:36:46,320
and uh there uh we were camped as i

1031
00:36:49,829 --> 00:36:48,240
think there were seven of us total

1032
00:36:51,589 --> 00:36:49,839
and we were camped near a spot where the

1033
00:36:53,910 --> 00:36:51,599
water was kind of murky and brown

1034
00:36:55,270 --> 00:36:53,920
it was kind of in a pond and we were you

1035
00:36:56,550 --> 00:36:55,280
know that's we didn't want to drink that

1036
00:36:57,829 --> 00:36:56,560
and i'd been there before and i said you

1037
00:36:59,109 --> 00:36:57,839
know i think right around the corner

1038
00:36:59,750 --> 00:36:59,119
from here we can walk for a little bit

1039
00:37:04,230 --> 00:36:59,760
and

1040
00:37:04,950 --> 00:37:04,240
this guy peter this friend of mine who

1041
00:37:08,790 --> 00:37:04,960
we actually became

1042
00:37:10,150 --> 00:37:08,800
good friends on this trip um we

1043
00:37:11,670 --> 00:37:10,160
collected everyone's water bottles and

1044
00:37:13,109 --> 00:37:11,680
put them on our backpacks and they were

1045
00:37:14,310 --> 00:37:13,119
empty and we walked off to the spring

1046
00:37:15,829 --> 00:37:14,320
and filled them all up and carried them

1047
00:37:16,790 --> 00:37:15,839
all back and it was really pleasant sun

1048
00:37:17,990 --> 00:37:16,800
was setting and

1049
00:37:19,829 --> 00:37:18,000
so we get back to the camp and

1050
00:37:21,589 --> 00:37:19,839
everyone's off in the woods doing a bear

1051
00:37:22,950 --> 00:37:21,599
hang this would have been in montana so

1052
00:37:24,390 --> 00:37:22,960
you just there's a way you can take a

1053
00:37:27,030 --> 00:37:24,400
cord and throw it above a

1054
00:37:28,150 --> 00:37:27,040
tree branch and haul your food up it

1055
00:37:29,430 --> 00:37:28,160
sounds easy sometimes it gets

1056
00:37:30,710 --> 00:37:29,440
complicated so we could hear people off

1057
00:37:31,829 --> 00:37:30,720
in the woods laughing and we knew just

1058
00:37:33,030 --> 00:37:31,839
what they were doing they were putting

1059
00:37:35,670 --> 00:37:33,040
up the bear hang so

1060
00:37:37,510 --> 00:37:35,680
we did something now i've worked in the

1061
00:37:39,750 --> 00:37:37,520
outdoors i'm 53 and i've worked

1062
00:37:41,270 --> 00:37:39,760
like half my life doing outdoor work we

1063
00:37:44,470 --> 00:37:41,280
did something that i've never

1064
00:37:45,190 --> 00:37:44,480
done before we the shelters were all set

1065
00:37:48,630 --> 00:37:45,200
up in this little

1066
00:37:50,390 --> 00:37:48,640
small meadow it was real pretty we

1067
00:37:51,910 --> 00:37:50,400
peter and i just laid on our backs and

1068
00:37:53,990 --> 00:37:51,920
looked up at the that the setting it

1069
00:37:55,349 --> 00:37:54,000
wasn't the stars weren't quite out yet

1070
00:37:57,109 --> 00:37:55,359
so we just laid on our backs and looked

1071
00:38:00,230 --> 00:37:57,119
straight up

1072
00:38:01,589 --> 00:38:00,240
we kept on talking uh it was pleasant

1073
00:38:04,710 --> 00:38:01,599
calm summer night

1074
00:38:06,310 --> 00:38:04,720
and uh and while we were talking there

1075
00:38:07,750 --> 00:38:06,320
was like a crashing noise it was

1076
00:38:08,630 --> 00:38:07,760
actually really loud and all of a sudden

1077
00:38:10,950 --> 00:38:08,640
that the

1078
00:38:12,710 --> 00:38:10,960
the sky above us just like erupted in

1079
00:38:14,870 --> 00:38:12,720
this little tiny meadow right so it was

1080
00:38:16,230 --> 00:38:14,880
ringed by trees a round ring of trees

1081
00:38:18,470 --> 00:38:16,240
inside this tiny meadow

1082
00:38:19,670 --> 00:38:18,480
just uh like you know a flurry of these

1083
00:38:20,630 --> 00:38:19,680
things and we're trying to count them

1084
00:38:21,990 --> 00:38:20,640
you know like well how many are there

1085
00:38:23,190 --> 00:38:22,000
this and there's owls there's owls

1086
00:38:25,349 --> 00:38:23,200
everywhere and we've been talking about

1087
00:38:28,310 --> 00:38:25,359
owls earlier in that day

1088
00:38:29,430 --> 00:38:28,320
and uh and it was there were five owls

1089
00:38:32,470 --> 00:38:29,440
that just flew around

1090
00:38:35,829 --> 00:38:32,480
and uh and then flew off so that that

1091
00:38:37,109 --> 00:38:35,839
uh you know and that that that

1092
00:38:39,349 --> 00:38:37,119
that's the kind of thing that had been

1093
00:38:41,829 --> 00:38:39,359
happening to me

1094
00:38:43,349 --> 00:38:41,839
on and on and on it has calmed down

1095
00:38:44,550 --> 00:38:43,359
greatly since then and i think part of

1096
00:38:46,310 --> 00:38:44,560
the reason it's calmed down is i don't

1097
00:38:47,750 --> 00:38:46,320
really need to

1098
00:38:49,910 --> 00:38:47,760
whatever i don't need to be convinced of

1099
00:38:51,349 --> 00:38:49,920
anything anymore i feel like

1100
00:38:53,430 --> 00:38:51,359
so i feel like i've already like well

1101
00:38:54,550 --> 00:38:53,440
aware of the the issue so the owls

1102
00:38:55,670 --> 00:38:54,560
basically realized like oh

1103
00:38:57,589 --> 00:38:55,680
they don't need to show up in my life

1104
00:38:59,430 --> 00:38:57,599
anymore because i think they got nothing

1105
00:39:00,790 --> 00:38:59,440
to prove to me at this point so

1106
00:39:02,950 --> 00:39:00,800
well how did you make the connection

1107
00:39:06,230 --> 00:39:02,960
with the owls and the uh

1108
00:39:10,230 --> 00:39:06,240
ufo encounters uh because you did have a

1109
00:39:14,230 --> 00:39:10,240
you did have an alien experience in 1993

1110
00:39:15,990 --> 00:39:14,240
uh but how did you make the connection

1111
00:39:17,829 --> 00:39:16,000
well the connection was actually pretty

1112
00:39:19,589 --> 00:39:17,839
well established in the literature so i

1113
00:39:22,150 --> 00:39:19,599
mean you read books by

1114
00:39:23,510 --> 00:39:22,160
bud hopkins or or whitley strieber uh

1115
00:39:24,150 --> 00:39:23,520
whitley streepers book communion he

1116
00:39:28,710 --> 00:39:24,160
talks about

1117
00:39:31,190 --> 00:39:28,720
uh the very first night that he had what

1118
00:39:32,790 --> 00:39:31,200
has become sort of the prototypical

1119
00:39:36,470 --> 00:39:32,800
bedroom visitation

1120
00:39:38,390 --> 00:39:36,480
that night was uh uh he he remembered an

1121
00:39:39,829 --> 00:39:38,400
owl that he thought was in the house but

1122
00:39:42,630 --> 00:39:39,839
but then he convinced himself it was

1123
00:39:44,390 --> 00:39:42,640
just outside in the windowsill and

1124
00:39:46,230 --> 00:39:44,400
it was winter time in upstate new york

1125
00:39:46,630 --> 00:39:46,240
and he went out and uh he went with his

1126
00:39:47,829 --> 00:39:46,640
wife

1127
00:39:50,710 --> 00:39:47,839
up to the window and looked at the

1128
00:39:52,470 --> 00:39:50,720
windowsill and there had been

1129
00:39:54,069 --> 00:39:52,480
snow on the windowsill and on the on the

1130
00:39:56,870 --> 00:39:54,079
roof line below there and there was no

1131
00:39:58,470 --> 00:39:56,880
footprints so um you know the snow was a

1132
00:40:00,630 --> 00:39:58,480
few days old so if he had actually seen

1133
00:40:02,550 --> 00:40:00,640
an owl out the window

1134
00:40:04,710 --> 00:40:02,560
it would have had to have left prince so

1135
00:40:07,829 --> 00:40:04,720
he he got kind of

1136
00:40:09,670 --> 00:40:07,839
uh it freaked him out obviously because

1137
00:40:10,390 --> 00:40:09,680
he remembered one thing but it couldn't

1138
00:40:13,990 --> 00:40:10,400
be

1139
00:40:15,270 --> 00:40:14,000
there was an owl on the windowsill it

1140
00:40:16,230 --> 00:40:15,280
must have left footprints which it

1141
00:40:19,109 --> 00:40:16,240
didn't

1142
00:40:20,710 --> 00:40:19,119
so and then if you um if you read the

1143
00:40:22,790 --> 00:40:20,720
literature of uh

1144
00:40:24,790 --> 00:40:22,800
oh gosh it's all over the place now in

1145
00:40:26,309 --> 00:40:24,800
the in the abduction

1146
00:40:29,109 --> 00:40:26,319
lore as far as the books that are out

1147
00:40:32,470 --> 00:40:29,119
there um and it's been co-opted by

1148
00:40:33,750 --> 00:40:32,480
movies and and uh twin peaks and the

1149
00:40:37,349 --> 00:40:33,760
movie the fourth kind

1150
00:40:39,190 --> 00:40:37,359
is that people will see what appears to

1151
00:40:41,270 --> 00:40:39,200
be a very large owl

1152
00:40:43,750 --> 00:40:41,280
um not not always a very large all but

1153
00:40:46,230 --> 00:40:43,760
it seems to be a large howl

1154
00:40:47,270 --> 00:40:46,240
and then they might have a missing time

1155
00:40:49,910 --> 00:40:47,280
event

1156
00:40:51,589 --> 00:40:49,920
and under hypnosis perhaps which is

1157
00:40:53,109 --> 00:40:51,599
tricky and i've actually talked to some

1158
00:40:55,190 --> 00:40:53,119
folks who've kind of come to terms with

1159
00:40:56,710 --> 00:40:55,200
it themselves without hypnosis

1160
00:41:00,069 --> 00:40:56,720
you know they'll see an owl and then

1161
00:41:01,750 --> 00:41:00,079
they'll realize it was impossibly large

1162
00:41:03,589 --> 00:41:01,760
right and the context of the owl was

1163
00:41:05,190 --> 00:41:03,599
strange and and then later they'll

1164
00:41:06,550 --> 00:41:05,200
they'll realize that what they had seen

1165
00:41:09,670 --> 00:41:06,560
was a

1166
00:41:10,790 --> 00:41:09,680
quite probably a gray alien bald head in

1167
00:41:13,109 --> 00:41:10,800
the big black eyes

1168
00:41:15,030 --> 00:41:13,119
i mentioned the four or four foot house

1169
00:41:16,470 --> 00:41:15,040
people that were encountering

1170
00:41:17,829 --> 00:41:16,480
uh a lot of them were actually while

1171
00:41:18,870 --> 00:41:17,839
people were driving and they would see

1172
00:41:22,069 --> 00:41:18,880
them on the road or

1173
00:41:25,670 --> 00:41:22,079
side of the road and uh

1174
00:41:27,510 --> 00:41:25,680
you you attributed this to screen memory

1175
00:41:29,430 --> 00:41:27,520
can you kind of explain what screen

1176
00:41:31,829 --> 00:41:29,440
memory is

1177
00:41:32,870 --> 00:41:31,839
well so the stories that i've heard a

1178
00:41:35,910 --> 00:41:32,880
lot of

1179
00:41:37,109 --> 00:41:35,920
is people driving down the road at night

1180
00:41:38,790 --> 00:41:37,119
and i've actually heard other stories

1181
00:41:40,309 --> 00:41:38,800
where owls are you know standing around

1182
00:41:41,270 --> 00:41:40,319
their bed at night and that's you know

1183
00:41:42,309 --> 00:41:41,280
like four foot tall

1184
00:41:44,550 --> 00:41:42,319
standing around their bed which is

1185
00:41:46,790 --> 00:41:44,560
equally impossible uh so

1186
00:41:47,990 --> 00:41:46,800
they'll uh they'll be an owl in the

1187
00:41:50,710 --> 00:41:48,000
middle of the road they'll pull right

1188
00:41:51,030 --> 00:41:50,720
up to it slow down pull right up to it

1189
00:41:52,870 --> 00:41:51,040
or

1190
00:41:54,630 --> 00:41:52,880
they'll pull right next to it but if

1191
00:41:56,550 --> 00:41:54,640
they pull up to it the owl is

1192
00:41:58,230 --> 00:41:56,560
taller tall enough that it can look over

1193
00:41:58,710 --> 00:41:58,240
the hood of the car like it's standing

1194
00:42:00,630 --> 00:41:58,720
upright

1195
00:42:01,910 --> 00:42:00,640
and it looks straight at the you know

1196
00:42:03,109 --> 00:42:01,920
straight basically eye to eye to the

1197
00:42:06,470 --> 00:42:03,119
windshield

1198
00:42:09,510 --> 00:42:06,480
um and uh

1199
00:42:11,270 --> 00:42:09,520
which is impossible i mean a big owl

1200
00:42:12,630 --> 00:42:11,280
whatever i mean you know given all the

1201
00:42:14,390 --> 00:42:12,640
owls in the world

1202
00:42:15,670 --> 00:42:14,400
i suspect there's not a single owl

1203
00:42:19,030 --> 00:42:15,680
that's above

1204
00:42:21,109 --> 00:42:19,040
36 inches 33

1205
00:42:22,550 --> 00:42:21,119
is tip to tail is how they measure them

1206
00:42:25,190 --> 00:42:22,560
and that would be an owl in flight not

1207
00:42:27,910 --> 00:42:25,200
an owl standing on the ground

1208
00:42:29,349 --> 00:42:27,920
so you know not a big a two foot tall

1209
00:42:31,270 --> 00:42:29,359
owl is a big

1210
00:42:33,190 --> 00:42:31,280
big owl and i don't think there's many

1211
00:42:34,630 --> 00:42:33,200
of those in the world

1212
00:42:36,550 --> 00:42:34,640
so to say that someone saw something

1213
00:42:39,750 --> 00:42:36,560
double that a four foot tall owl

1214
00:42:43,190 --> 00:42:39,760
is unimaginable so uh

1215
00:42:46,470 --> 00:42:43,200
afterwards after this event they might

1216
00:42:48,230 --> 00:42:46,480
arrive home and say like oh i'm like

1217
00:42:49,190 --> 00:42:48,240
something weird you know the time is

1218
00:42:50,550 --> 00:42:49,200
wrong i should have been home at

1219
00:42:52,790 --> 00:42:50,560
midnight but it's 2 a.m

1220
00:42:54,390 --> 00:42:52,800
so you know in some form or another i've

1221
00:42:57,750 --> 00:42:54,400
heard this story a lot

1222
00:43:01,190 --> 00:42:59,910
what what's what plays out is that this

1223
00:43:04,230 --> 00:43:01,200
would be a

1224
00:43:08,550 --> 00:43:04,240
in that allotment of missing time

1225
00:43:10,230 --> 00:43:08,560
would be a a an abduction event

1226
00:43:12,710 --> 00:43:10,240
quite probably someone was taken on

1227
00:43:15,670 --> 00:43:12,720
board a craft

1228
00:43:16,230 --> 00:43:15,680
and uh so so those are the stories that

1229
00:43:20,309 --> 00:43:16,240
are

1230
00:43:21,750 --> 00:43:20,319
literature by multiple authors from

1231
00:43:24,150 --> 00:43:21,760
from different points of view and such

1232
00:43:25,910 --> 00:43:24,160
so people with different agendas will

1233
00:43:29,109 --> 00:43:25,920
will retell these same stories because

1234
00:43:32,470 --> 00:43:29,119
they're so commonly reported

1235
00:43:35,510 --> 00:43:32,480
well you know the the one

1236
00:43:38,230 --> 00:43:35,520
the one event that you talked about

1237
00:43:39,829 --> 00:43:38,240
that kind of surprised me was well it

1238
00:43:42,470 --> 00:43:39,839
wasn't surprising but it was

1239
00:43:45,109 --> 00:43:42,480
it was very vivid uh where you were at

1240
00:43:47,270 --> 00:43:45,119
an abductee support group meeting

1241
00:43:49,349 --> 00:43:47,280
at the ufo conference in walton where

1242
00:43:51,750 --> 00:43:49,359
you were sitting in

1243
00:43:53,750 --> 00:43:51,760
and uh there was one guy that was

1244
00:43:55,190 --> 00:43:53,760
sitting there silent for the entire

1245
00:43:57,030 --> 00:43:55,200
two-hour session

1246
00:43:58,230 --> 00:43:57,040
but near the end you ruined his hand and

1247
00:44:00,790 --> 00:43:58,240
asked that

1248
00:44:02,309 --> 00:44:00,800
had anybody had any experiences with

1249
00:44:05,349 --> 00:44:02,319
owls

1250
00:44:06,790 --> 00:44:05,359
and he even know you said he nearly told

1251
00:44:08,230 --> 00:44:06,800
himself out of the chair with pretty

1252
00:44:09,109 --> 00:44:08,240
much everybody in the room raised their

1253
00:44:10,790 --> 00:44:09,119
hand

1254
00:44:12,309 --> 00:44:10,800
yeah yeah everyone including me yeah

1255
00:44:13,670 --> 00:44:12,319
yeah so everyone raised their hand so

1256
00:44:15,829 --> 00:44:13,680
it's very common

1257
00:44:17,030 --> 00:44:15,839
and what's what i find more interesting

1258
00:44:18,950 --> 00:44:17,040
in the you know so he

1259
00:44:20,309 --> 00:44:18,960
he later he then told his story he was a

1260
00:44:21,349 --> 00:44:20,319
nice guy i spoke to him for a long time

1261
00:44:23,030 --> 00:44:21,359
afterwards

1262
00:44:24,550 --> 00:44:23,040
he's told a story to the group he said

1263
00:44:26,230 --> 00:44:24,560
listen i had the story i was

1264
00:44:28,550 --> 00:44:26,240
driving around at night and there was

1265
00:44:30,630 --> 00:44:28,560
this owl on the side of the road

1266
00:44:32,309 --> 00:44:30,640
and it was tall it was like four foot

1267
00:44:33,990 --> 00:44:32,319
tall and he kind of pulled up to it you

1268
00:44:35,750 --> 00:44:34,000
know and kind of rolled the window down

1269
00:44:35,990 --> 00:44:35,760
and like looked right at it and he got

1270
00:44:37,589 --> 00:44:36,000
this

1271
00:44:39,910 --> 00:44:37,599
really bad vibe like he wasn't supposed

1272
00:44:43,109 --> 00:44:39,920
to be there and he was like the owl was

1273
00:44:45,109 --> 00:44:43,119
angry at him so he left he drove off

1274
00:44:47,270 --> 00:44:45,119
and and later he's a photographer later

1275
00:44:49,030 --> 00:44:47,280
he went to take pictures of some owls in

1276
00:44:50,470 --> 00:44:49,040
a forest

1277
00:44:52,150 --> 00:44:50,480
got his camera out and he's looking at

1278
00:44:53,430 --> 00:44:52,160
these real owls and as soon as he saw a

1279
00:44:55,910 --> 00:44:53,440
real owl

1280
00:44:57,109 --> 00:44:55,920
he said ooh i don't think that was an

1281
00:44:58,230 --> 00:44:57,119
owl that i saw that night it was

1282
00:44:59,750 --> 00:44:58,240
something else

1283
00:45:01,829 --> 00:44:59,760
and he explored it he went through

1284
00:45:03,109 --> 00:45:01,839
hypnotic regression

1285
00:45:04,710 --> 00:45:03,119
and it was a therapist if i'm not

1286
00:45:06,230 --> 00:45:04,720
mistaken that had nothing to do with

1287
00:45:08,390 --> 00:45:06,240
with um

1288
00:45:11,109 --> 00:45:08,400
ufo research and so he said very little

1289
00:45:13,349 --> 00:45:11,119
came up in the hypnotic hypnosis session

1290
00:45:15,589 --> 00:45:13,359
except he felt that he the owl that he

1291
00:45:18,630 --> 00:45:15,599
saw was wearing boots

1292
00:45:19,670 --> 00:45:18,640
so uh which you know i'll obviously

1293
00:45:22,950 --> 00:45:19,680
don't wear our boots

1294
00:45:25,349 --> 00:45:22,960
so he was um you know that was a perfect

1295
00:45:26,390 --> 00:45:25,359
example of what the screen memory would

1296
00:45:29,750 --> 00:45:26,400
be

1297
00:45:32,550 --> 00:45:29,760
uh you know that that in in uh though

1298
00:45:33,190 --> 00:45:32,560
that was a hypnotherapist couldn't get

1299
00:45:34,550 --> 00:45:33,200
past

1300
00:45:36,790 --> 00:45:34,560
it couldn't get much deeper than what

1301
00:45:38,550 --> 00:45:36,800
his conscious memory was of seeing an

1302
00:45:39,510 --> 00:45:38,560
owl that's what he consciously remembers

1303
00:45:41,670 --> 00:45:39,520
though though

1304
00:45:43,190 --> 00:45:41,680
my i suspect strongly that something

1305
00:45:45,990 --> 00:45:43,200
much more

1306
00:45:47,109 --> 00:45:46,000
happened that he he has no that is in

1307
00:45:50,390 --> 00:45:47,119
some form or another his

1308
00:45:51,589 --> 00:45:50,400
his memory had been has been erased in a

1309
00:45:53,109 --> 00:45:51,599
way that i don't understand how that

1310
00:45:54,069 --> 00:45:53,119
works but that's my sense that's what

1311
00:45:57,589 --> 00:45:54,079
happened to him

1312
00:45:59,430 --> 00:45:57,599
as well as many other folks now

1313
00:46:00,630 --> 00:45:59,440
you and you didn't mention in the book

1314
00:46:03,430 --> 00:46:00,640
as well

1315
00:46:05,750 --> 00:46:03,440
about um you know you had to ask people

1316
00:46:08,790 --> 00:46:05,760
who might have had abduction experiences

1317
00:46:10,790 --> 00:46:08,800
if they can wear a watch and you say

1318
00:46:14,390 --> 00:46:10,800
curiously many say they can't

1319
00:46:16,950 --> 00:46:14,400
now though you say you're able to do it

1320
00:46:18,790 --> 00:46:16,960
uh that inductees who also report that

1321
00:46:21,190 --> 00:46:18,800
street lights turn off

1322
00:46:23,190 --> 00:46:21,200
above them when they're driving at night

1323
00:46:24,790 --> 00:46:23,200
and walking under them

1324
00:46:27,510 --> 00:46:24,800
and that has happened to me a few times

1325
00:46:28,950 --> 00:46:27,520
yeah i i know people that has happened

1326
00:46:32,309 --> 00:46:28,960
to

1327
00:46:35,190 --> 00:46:32,319
and uh now what

1328
00:46:37,109 --> 00:46:35,200
causes that do you think wow i mean i

1329
00:46:40,790 --> 00:46:37,119
have no idea what causes that

1330
00:46:44,550 --> 00:46:40,800
my sense is that there's kind of a um

1331
00:46:46,630 --> 00:46:44,560
oh like a trickster-like power

1332
00:46:49,190 --> 00:46:46,640
to whatever's at the source of this kind

1333
00:46:52,870 --> 00:46:49,200
of uh this ufo

1334
00:46:54,069 --> 00:46:52,880
uh you know the the source of the

1335
00:46:56,390 --> 00:46:54,079
mystery

1336
00:46:58,230 --> 00:46:56,400
um and i think that uh personally i

1337
00:46:59,750 --> 00:46:58,240
think that little men in spaceships

1338
00:47:02,950 --> 00:46:59,760
coming from another planet

1339
00:47:05,589 --> 00:47:02,960
here to visit us isn't entirely

1340
00:47:07,109 --> 00:47:05,599
the whole story that may be a part of it

1341
00:47:07,589 --> 00:47:07,119
but i think something much weirder is

1342
00:47:10,069 --> 00:47:07,599
going on

1343
00:47:11,190 --> 00:47:10,079
that than that that's too simplistic

1344
00:47:17,030 --> 00:47:11,200
explanation

1345
00:47:20,950 --> 00:47:18,390
oh what we were just saying i just lost

1346
00:47:23,990 --> 00:47:20,960
my train of thought here

1347
00:47:25,670 --> 00:47:24,000
oh about the abduction experiences yeah

1348
00:47:27,670 --> 00:47:25,680
so oh the street lights that's right

1349
00:47:29,670 --> 00:47:27,680
exactly so my sense is that that like

1350
00:47:31,349 --> 00:47:29,680
there's some something planning out with

1351
00:47:34,549 --> 00:47:31,359
the street lights

1352
00:47:36,950 --> 00:47:34,559
that is um uh

1353
00:47:37,990 --> 00:47:36,960
like something's at play you know i

1354
00:47:41,349 --> 00:47:38,000
don't think

1355
00:47:44,150 --> 00:47:41,359
that the the the the person

1356
00:47:45,589 --> 00:47:44,160
is like emanating some electromagnetic

1357
00:47:47,589 --> 00:47:45,599
field that's turning off the

1358
00:47:49,030 --> 00:47:47,599
off the off the street light i don't

1359
00:47:51,349 --> 00:47:49,040
think that's the solution

1360
00:47:54,150 --> 00:47:51,359
or that's the cause i think that the

1361
00:47:55,829 --> 00:47:54,160
street light is being turned off

1362
00:47:57,670 --> 00:47:55,839
in some form i don't know how it's

1363
00:48:00,710 --> 00:47:57,680
happening but i sense it's happening

1364
00:48:04,390 --> 00:48:00,720
as a way to um

1365
00:48:06,470 --> 00:48:04,400
just uh give a a nudge to the to the

1366
00:48:08,710 --> 00:48:06,480
individual that that something

1367
00:48:09,990 --> 00:48:08,720
you know stranger is at play with

1368
00:48:11,910 --> 00:48:10,000
reality

1369
00:48:13,430 --> 00:48:11,920
um and i know people who who have driven

1370
00:48:14,870 --> 00:48:13,440
down the street it's happened to me

1371
00:48:15,910 --> 00:48:14,880
on one occasion where i've driven down

1372
00:48:17,510 --> 00:48:15,920
the street and the street lights have

1373
00:48:20,069 --> 00:48:17,520
gone off one after another

1374
00:48:21,589 --> 00:48:20,079
you know as i've gone under it now

1375
00:48:21,829 --> 00:48:21,599
that's only happened once for me and i

1376
00:48:23,349 --> 00:48:21,839
know

1377
00:48:25,670 --> 00:48:23,359
other folks who tell that's happened

1378
00:48:27,990 --> 00:48:25,680
many times

1379
00:48:29,670 --> 00:48:28,000
have you uh have you heard of people

1380
00:48:31,270 --> 00:48:29,680
experiencing other bizarre things like

1381
00:48:32,630 --> 00:48:31,280
that

1382
00:48:34,309 --> 00:48:32,640
oh yeah i mean there's all kinds of

1383
00:48:35,589 --> 00:48:34,319
things like that i mean i've collected a

1384
00:48:36,790 --> 00:48:35,599
few stories there's one in the book of

1385
00:48:39,430 --> 00:48:36,800
people getting phantom

1386
00:48:41,510 --> 00:48:39,440
text you know like these gobbledygook

1387
00:48:43,030 --> 00:48:41,520
texts that are kind of cryptic and with

1388
00:48:45,270 --> 00:48:43,040
misspellings and

1389
00:48:46,950 --> 00:48:45,280
and oftentimes it'll be the you know

1390
00:48:48,870 --> 00:48:46,960
boyfriend texting the girlfriend

1391
00:48:49,910 --> 00:48:48,880
and the girlfriend has seen a ufo and

1392
00:48:51,910 --> 00:48:49,920
the boyfriend is like what are you

1393
00:48:54,069 --> 00:48:51,920
sending me these texts for

1394
00:48:55,829 --> 00:48:54,079
and when she reads the text it doesn't

1395
00:48:56,630 --> 00:48:55,839
make any sense that's there's an account

1396
00:48:58,870 --> 00:48:56,640
of that in the book

1397
00:49:01,430 --> 00:48:58,880
this is someone who's seen both ufo and

1398
00:49:04,790 --> 00:49:01,440
seeing owls

1399
00:49:06,470 --> 00:49:04,800
so there's this odd stuff that plays out

1400
00:49:08,790 --> 00:49:06,480
uh yeah so that would be when i've got a

1401
00:49:12,950 --> 00:49:08,800
few examples of that

1402
00:49:18,549 --> 00:49:16,150
uh before we get too far can you talk

1403
00:49:20,870 --> 00:49:18,559
a bit about your uh first ailing

1404
00:49:24,150 --> 00:49:20,880
experience the one from 1993

1405
00:49:27,190 --> 00:49:24,160
and what you saw outside on your lawn

1406
00:49:30,390 --> 00:49:27,200
i was that would have been i was so i'm

1407
00:49:31,349 --> 00:49:30,400
53 now i would have been 30

1408
00:49:34,150 --> 00:49:31,359
because that would have been in the

1409
00:49:36,390 --> 00:49:34,160
winter of 92 93 it was probably january

1410
00:49:38,710 --> 00:49:36,400
or february of 1992. i don't know if i

1411
00:49:41,109 --> 00:49:38,720
can pinpoint it any better than that

1412
00:49:43,109 --> 00:49:41,119
and i was at home alone i was living at

1413
00:49:44,390 --> 00:49:43,119
a house in maine

1414
00:49:45,990 --> 00:49:44,400
and i woke up in the middle of the night

1415
00:49:47,829 --> 00:49:46,000
and there was a bright light shining

1416
00:49:50,390 --> 00:49:47,839
through the bedroom window

1417
00:49:52,069 --> 00:49:50,400
and i sat up on my elbow and and kind of

1418
00:49:53,910 --> 00:49:52,079
looked out the window

1419
00:49:55,430 --> 00:49:53,920
uh there's a motion sensor light out

1420
00:49:56,870 --> 00:49:55,440
there so i didn't really think too much

1421
00:49:59,510 --> 00:49:56,880
of it

1422
00:50:00,069 --> 00:49:59,520
uh but when i looked out there was a

1423
00:50:03,589 --> 00:50:00,079
bright

1424
00:50:04,230 --> 00:50:03,599
light in the yard but that was kind of

1425
00:50:07,270 --> 00:50:04,240
far away

1426
00:50:10,870 --> 00:50:07,280
but what was up close to the window were

1427
00:50:11,589 --> 00:50:10,880
five of the typical spindly gray aliens

1428
00:50:14,230 --> 00:50:11,599
that

1429
00:50:15,109 --> 00:50:14,240
you know we all recognize now and they

1430
00:50:18,230 --> 00:50:15,119
were

1431
00:50:19,910 --> 00:50:18,240
clearly moving towards the house and

1432
00:50:20,630 --> 00:50:19,920
they were backlit by something very

1433
00:50:23,349 --> 00:50:20,640
bright

1434
00:50:24,069 --> 00:50:23,359
so super spooky creepy image i've drawn

1435
00:50:26,950 --> 00:50:24,079
it

1436
00:50:28,710 --> 00:50:26,960
and the uh you know the images really

1437
00:50:29,670 --> 00:50:28,720
are resting and it was it was hard to

1438
00:50:33,109 --> 00:50:29,680
draw it was

1439
00:50:35,349 --> 00:50:33,119
you know so but even though the image

1440
00:50:39,270 --> 00:50:35,359
itself was frightening

1441
00:50:42,630 --> 00:50:41,109
almost without any emotion at all it was

1442
00:50:47,270 --> 00:50:42,640
actually like i was sucked dry

1443
00:50:51,430 --> 00:50:47,280
of any emotion so i was uh

1444
00:50:53,349 --> 00:50:51,440
um you know without any any

1445
00:50:55,030 --> 00:50:53,359
emotional response at all i should have

1446
00:50:56,630 --> 00:50:55,040
you know jumped out of the bed and

1447
00:50:57,990 --> 00:50:56,640
grabbed a baseball bat and locked all

1448
00:51:00,470 --> 00:50:58,000
the doors and

1449
00:51:01,829 --> 00:51:00,480
but i didn't and what happened was i i

1450
00:51:03,270 --> 00:51:01,839
heard a voice in my head now it could

1451
00:51:04,549 --> 00:51:03,280
have been my voice

1452
00:51:06,790 --> 00:51:04,559
but i definitely heard a very clear

1453
00:51:07,430 --> 00:51:06,800
voice in my head that said now is the

1454
00:51:09,109 --> 00:51:07,440
time

1455
00:51:10,549 --> 00:51:09,119
to shut down and put your head in the

1456
00:51:12,309 --> 00:51:10,559
pillow

1457
00:51:13,910 --> 00:51:12,319
wow excuse me let me rephrase that now

1458
00:51:15,589 --> 00:51:13,920
is the time to put your head on the

1459
00:51:17,030 --> 00:51:15,599
pillow and shut down

1460
00:51:18,390 --> 00:51:17,040
and that's exactly what i did i just

1461
00:51:20,710 --> 00:51:18,400
laid down and went to bed i went to

1462
00:51:22,630 --> 00:51:20,720
sleep like snap like i was gone asleep

1463
00:51:24,950 --> 00:51:22,640
and the next morning i just dismissed it

1464
00:51:28,069 --> 00:51:24,960
entirely as a dream

1465
00:51:29,030 --> 00:51:28,079
and um and since then you know i didn't

1466
00:51:31,589 --> 00:51:29,040
even go out and see if there were

1467
00:51:34,870 --> 00:51:31,599
footprints in the snow

1468
00:51:35,829 --> 00:51:34,880
and since then i've i have come to treat

1469
00:51:39,430 --> 00:51:35,839
that event is

1470
00:51:41,109 --> 00:51:39,440
probably a real event

1471
00:51:43,030 --> 00:51:41,119
where i probably saw something real out

1472
00:51:44,309 --> 00:51:43,040
the window though at the time i had no

1473
00:51:46,630 --> 00:51:44,319
way of

1474
00:51:48,230 --> 00:51:46,640
of uh i mean at the time i just was like

1475
00:51:48,950 --> 00:51:48,240
there was no way i was going down that

1476
00:51:51,589 --> 00:51:48,960
road it was

1477
00:51:52,309 --> 00:51:51,599
it was completely a dream how long did

1478
00:51:55,430 --> 00:51:52,319
it take you

1479
00:51:56,790 --> 00:51:55,440
to talk about that publicly you know

1480
00:51:58,230 --> 00:51:56,800
well publicly i mean i'm doing it on a

1481
00:51:59,829 --> 00:51:58,240
podcast now but i mean i would tell my

1482
00:52:01,349 --> 00:51:59,839
friends like wow i had this super trippy

1483
00:52:03,270 --> 00:52:01,359
dream last night you know like i would

1484
00:52:05,109 --> 00:52:03,280
be very vivid and tell you just exactly

1485
00:52:06,390 --> 00:52:05,119
what i told you and it was very clear

1486
00:52:06,870 --> 00:52:06,400
and very it was you know i could say

1487
00:52:09,030 --> 00:52:06,880
things like

1488
00:52:10,790 --> 00:52:09,040
you know i've had other dreams and boy

1489
00:52:12,230 --> 00:52:10,800
they they feel like a dream you know

1490
00:52:13,349 --> 00:52:12,240
there's kind of a dream logic and i

1491
00:52:15,109 --> 00:52:13,359
never dream that i'm

1492
00:52:17,270 --> 00:52:15,119
in the bed that i'm in right you know so

1493
00:52:18,710 --> 00:52:17,280
there i was in the bed in the bedroom

1494
00:52:20,230 --> 00:52:18,720
looking out the window right next to the

1495
00:52:22,150 --> 00:52:20,240
bed if i was in a dream there would be

1496
00:52:23,510 --> 00:52:22,160
some sort of distorted logic associated

1497
00:52:24,309 --> 00:52:23,520
with that the room wouldn't be shaped

1498
00:52:28,309 --> 00:52:24,319
right or

1499
00:52:29,990 --> 00:52:28,319
or i wouldn't you know so uh

1500
00:52:31,190 --> 00:52:30,000
so yeah so that was right away i mean i

1501
00:52:32,069 --> 00:52:31,200
remember talking about it right away

1502
00:52:35,829 --> 00:52:32,079
with folks

1503
00:52:37,510 --> 00:52:35,839
and uh but it never um

1504
00:52:39,030 --> 00:52:37,520
you know it was a few years later before

1505
00:52:45,349 --> 00:52:39,040
i really entertained the fact that

1506
00:52:48,790 --> 00:52:47,430
um experience you think that incident

1507
00:52:51,829 --> 00:52:48,800
might have led to

1508
00:52:53,750 --> 00:52:51,839
uh possible abduction or any further

1509
00:52:56,870 --> 00:52:53,760
type of uh

1510
00:52:57,990 --> 00:52:56,880
encounter with these aliens well that

1511
00:53:00,950 --> 00:52:58,000
and a handful of other

1512
00:53:02,230 --> 00:53:00,960
events in my life i mean i feel strongly

1513
00:53:02,790 --> 00:53:02,240
i mean guess the way i put it you know

1514
00:53:04,390 --> 00:53:02,800
like i mean i

1515
00:53:06,470 --> 00:53:04,400
you know so you watch late night cable

1516
00:53:08,390 --> 00:53:06,480
tv right now there's like this creepy

1517
00:53:10,549 --> 00:53:08,400
documentary about ufo abduction and

1518
00:53:13,190 --> 00:53:10,559
stuff and they have the

1519
00:53:14,150 --> 00:53:13,200
you know the corny reenactments and

1520
00:53:16,390 --> 00:53:14,160
scary music

1521
00:53:17,430 --> 00:53:16,400
and and uh you know people being taken

1522
00:53:18,710 --> 00:53:17,440
out of their bed at night or being

1523
00:53:20,470 --> 00:53:18,720
lifted out of their car or something

1524
00:53:22,549 --> 00:53:20,480
like that so i mean i think everyone in

1525
00:53:23,430 --> 00:53:22,559
the world has seen that in some form or

1526
00:53:27,589 --> 00:53:23,440
another due to

1527
00:53:29,750 --> 00:53:27,599
you know you know tacky tv documentaries

1528
00:53:31,430 --> 00:53:29,760
but i don't have any of those memories i

1529
00:53:33,910 --> 00:53:31,440
got none of that um

1530
00:53:34,870 --> 00:53:33,920
what i do have in a way is is like you

1531
00:53:37,349 --> 00:53:34,880
know if you put a

1532
00:53:38,390 --> 00:53:37,359
a puzzle on the table right and you can

1533
00:53:39,670 --> 00:53:38,400
and all the puzzle

1534
00:53:41,670 --> 00:53:39,680
most of the puzzle pieces are on there

1535
00:53:42,950 --> 00:53:41,680
but there's a few key puzzles pieces

1536
00:53:44,150 --> 00:53:42,960
that are missing right so the little

1537
00:53:45,750 --> 00:53:44,160
holes in the puzzle

1538
00:53:47,510 --> 00:53:45,760
you can still step back look at the

1539
00:53:47,990 --> 00:53:47,520
table and say oh that's a sailboat on a

1540
00:53:50,069 --> 00:53:48,000
lake

1541
00:53:51,510 --> 00:53:50,079
you know you can see it clearly and i'm

1542
00:53:52,630 --> 00:53:51,520
at the point now where i don't have

1543
00:53:54,150 --> 00:53:52,640
those memories

1544
00:53:56,309 --> 00:53:54,160
you know like what i just you know like

1545
00:53:57,589 --> 00:53:56,319
the the the pop culture memories as i

1546
00:53:59,750 --> 00:53:57,599
refer to those

1547
00:54:01,670 --> 00:53:59,760
but i seem to have all the puzzle pieces

1548
00:54:04,150 --> 00:54:01,680
around those memories

1549
00:54:06,150 --> 00:54:04,160
so so i can clearly stand back and look

1550
00:54:06,950 --> 00:54:06,160
at my own experiences and say well i

1551
00:54:10,150 --> 00:54:06,960
feel

1552
00:54:11,670 --> 00:54:10,160
highly probable okay

1553
00:54:12,870 --> 00:54:11,680
i'm pretty much convinced at that point

1554
00:54:13,990 --> 00:54:12,880
that's this point in my life that i've

1555
00:54:15,430 --> 00:54:14,000
had these experiences

1556
00:54:17,430 --> 00:54:15,440
though i don't have any kind of

1557
00:54:18,790 --> 00:54:17,440
conscious memory of being on board a

1558
00:54:21,510 --> 00:54:18,800
craft or something like that

1559
00:54:24,549 --> 00:54:21,520
oh okay okay you know there was one

1560
00:54:27,670 --> 00:54:24,559
particular story in the book that

1561
00:54:31,349 --> 00:54:27,680
that kind of got me thinking uh

1562
00:54:33,670 --> 00:54:31,359
louise's story as far as her and the

1563
00:54:34,549 --> 00:54:33,680
large owls that was standing at the edge

1564
00:54:36,470 --> 00:54:34,559
of the pier

1565
00:54:37,990 --> 00:54:36,480
yeah that was a beautiful one yeah that

1566
00:54:40,309 --> 00:54:38,000
was can you can you

1567
00:54:42,230 --> 00:54:40,319
uh describe that for the listening

1568
00:54:43,430 --> 00:54:42,240
audience it was really interesting

1569
00:54:44,630 --> 00:54:43,440
this has been this is funny because i

1570
00:54:46,390 --> 00:54:44,640
mean there's a father's like i don't

1571
00:54:48,069 --> 00:54:46,400
know the book's nearly 400 pages long

1572
00:54:48,950 --> 00:54:48,079
and there's just one story after another

1573
00:54:52,789 --> 00:54:48,960
after another so

1574
00:54:56,150 --> 00:54:52,799
so so louise um she was living in

1575
00:54:57,829 --> 00:54:56,160
canada i'm pretty sure and she had this

1576
00:54:59,190 --> 00:54:57,839
pole to go out and walk her dog

1577
00:55:01,270 --> 00:54:59,200
she's a big german shepherd i think the

1578
00:55:04,870 --> 00:55:01,280
dog was named stryker and

1579
00:55:06,470 --> 00:55:04,880
you know and she it was very unlike her

1580
00:55:08,870 --> 00:55:06,480
to go out in the pouring rain

1581
00:55:10,230 --> 00:55:08,880
and walk the dog but she got this kind

1582
00:55:11,589 --> 00:55:10,240
of like oh i'm gonna go walk the dog and

1583
00:55:12,150 --> 00:55:11,599
she just walked out there and just like

1584
00:55:15,030 --> 00:55:12,160
it was

1585
00:55:16,549 --> 00:55:15,040
unusual for her to walk the dog in the

1586
00:55:19,589 --> 00:55:16,559
rain

1587
00:55:20,870 --> 00:55:19,599
and she lived near the water near the

1588
00:55:22,470 --> 00:55:20,880
salt water the ocean

1589
00:55:23,270 --> 00:55:22,480
and there was a big jetty that went out

1590
00:55:25,030 --> 00:55:23,280
and that was one of the things they

1591
00:55:26,789 --> 00:55:25,040
would do on this walk there's this long

1592
00:55:28,630 --> 00:55:26,799
jetty that would go out into the to the

1593
00:55:30,150 --> 00:55:28,640
bay and then she would walk to the end

1594
00:55:32,150 --> 00:55:30,160
turn around come back so she

1595
00:55:33,670 --> 00:55:32,160
started walking down the jetty and then

1596
00:55:35,030 --> 00:55:33,680
she got kind of like

1597
00:55:37,190 --> 00:55:35,040
at a certain point and said what am i

1598
00:55:38,789 --> 00:55:37,200
doing i'm gonna turn around and go back

1599
00:55:40,870 --> 00:55:38,799
and as she turned around went back there

1600
00:55:44,150 --> 00:55:40,880
was a large owl

1601
00:55:46,150 --> 00:55:44,160
standing on so she was totally alone on

1602
00:55:49,109 --> 00:55:46,160
the jetty on this long

1603
00:55:50,950 --> 00:55:49,119
dock basically uh and she walked right

1604
00:55:53,670 --> 00:55:50,960
up to this owl

1605
00:55:55,510 --> 00:55:53,680
and it's so funny i mean this is you

1606
00:55:57,190 --> 00:55:55,520
know like you go back and forth i shared

1607
00:55:58,789 --> 00:55:57,200
the story with she shared the story with

1608
00:55:59,910 --> 00:55:58,799
me and i went back and forth with

1609
00:56:02,150 --> 00:55:59,920
correspondence

1610
00:56:03,430 --> 00:56:02,160
and i was just struck by the the words

1611
00:56:05,030 --> 00:56:03,440
she would use

1612
00:56:07,109 --> 00:56:05,040
you know she said basically said she was

1613
00:56:08,950 --> 00:56:07,119
like like it was like royalty

1614
00:56:11,750 --> 00:56:08,960
she walked right up to this owl stood

1615
00:56:14,470 --> 00:56:11,760
right before it and her dog

1616
00:56:16,549 --> 00:56:14,480
who was usually like would be [\h__\h]

1617
00:56:18,710 --> 00:56:16,559
around a bird a big bird you know

1618
00:56:19,670 --> 00:56:18,720
chase a bird and get all hyper the dog

1619
00:56:23,190 --> 00:56:19,680
was absolutely

1620
00:56:24,470 --> 00:56:23,200
like calm and reverent

1621
00:56:26,870 --> 00:56:24,480
you know she describes it as like

1622
00:56:29,510 --> 00:56:26,880
meeting royalty

1623
00:56:30,630 --> 00:56:29,520
so she meets and this is the woman who

1624
00:56:33,990 --> 00:56:30,640
had had a lot of

1625
00:56:34,870 --> 00:56:34,000
ufo contact in her life she's very clear

1626
00:56:38,390 --> 00:56:34,880
that she's had

1627
00:56:40,230 --> 00:56:38,400
um ufo experiences and you know it would

1628
00:56:41,910 --> 00:56:40,240
fall into the category of abductee or

1629
00:56:42,870 --> 00:56:41,920
contactee or whatever word you would

1630
00:56:45,349 --> 00:56:42,880
want to use

1631
00:56:47,990 --> 00:56:45,359
so and then after that there came a

1632
00:56:49,430 --> 00:56:48,000
point when the owl just flew off

1633
00:56:51,589 --> 00:56:49,440
and then she went and this is very

1634
00:56:53,990 --> 00:56:51,599
interesting she's she said it was

1635
00:56:54,870 --> 00:56:54,000
you know as big a bird as she's ever

1636
00:56:56,870 --> 00:56:54,880
seen

1637
00:56:58,230 --> 00:56:56,880
and she went through all the books and

1638
00:57:01,270 --> 00:56:58,240
she's seen great

1639
00:57:02,630 --> 00:57:01,280
uh or great gray owls and she'd seen

1640
00:57:03,670 --> 00:57:02,640
snowy owls and

1641
00:57:04,789 --> 00:57:03,680
she went through all these books and

1642
00:57:06,470 --> 00:57:04,799
tried to figure out what kind of owl it

1643
00:57:08,150 --> 00:57:06,480
was she lived near the ocean and she was

1644
00:57:09,270 --> 00:57:08,160
familiar with all kinds of sea birds and

1645
00:57:10,309 --> 00:57:09,280
things like that and there was there's

1646
00:57:12,630 --> 00:57:10,319
nothing it didn't match

1647
00:57:15,270 --> 00:57:12,640
didn't match anything in the books

1648
00:57:18,870 --> 00:57:15,280
although she's convinced it was an owl

1649
00:57:21,910 --> 00:57:18,880
now she right after that

1650
00:57:25,030 --> 00:57:21,920
she was diagnosed with a very

1651
00:57:29,030 --> 00:57:25,040
dangerous form of cancer and

1652
00:57:29,750 --> 00:57:29,040
they uh they operated on her remove the

1653
00:57:31,349 --> 00:57:29,760
cancer and they

1654
00:57:33,270 --> 00:57:31,359
well she just went right up to death's

1655
00:57:35,589 --> 00:57:33,280
door and so she

1656
00:57:37,589 --> 00:57:35,599
feels she's doing great now she's been

1657
00:57:40,630 --> 00:57:37,599
cancer-free for many years now

1658
00:57:44,069 --> 00:57:40,640
she feels that that meeting that owl was

1659
00:57:45,589 --> 00:57:44,079
was like um like an announcement like

1660
00:57:47,109 --> 00:57:45,599
that a new chapter of her life would

1661
00:57:51,190 --> 00:57:47,119
begin and that chapter would be

1662
00:57:53,270 --> 00:57:51,200
very difficult uh so

1663
00:57:54,549 --> 00:57:53,280
yeah this this is this kind of things

1664
00:57:56,150 --> 00:57:54,559
that i've been

1665
00:57:58,069 --> 00:57:56,160
encountering when receiving these

1666
00:58:01,109 --> 00:57:58,079
stories these very

1667
00:58:02,390 --> 00:58:01,119
you know almost beautiful stories these

1668
00:58:05,270 --> 00:58:02,400
very very powerful

1669
00:58:05,990 --> 00:58:05,280
mystical stories and and they sound like

1670
00:58:08,150 --> 00:58:06,000
they follow

1671
00:58:09,510 --> 00:58:08,160
dream logic they sound like uh like

1672
00:58:11,430 --> 00:58:09,520
something from a fable

1673
00:58:13,670 --> 00:58:11,440
though though the people you know are

1674
00:58:15,510 --> 00:58:13,680
very forceful that these things truly

1675
00:58:19,030 --> 00:58:15,520
happened

1676
00:58:22,789 --> 00:58:19,040
yeah it kind of touched me i um i i knew

1677
00:58:26,390 --> 00:58:22,799
you had uh you had talked to uh

1678
00:58:28,789 --> 00:58:26,400
uh whitley and anna streeter for years

1679
00:58:30,230 --> 00:58:28,799
and she saw a connection with al's in

1680
00:58:33,430 --> 00:58:30,240
death

1681
00:58:34,390 --> 00:58:33,440
and i've been having sight i'm gonna get

1682
00:58:36,230 --> 00:58:34,400
personal now

1683
00:58:37,510 --> 00:58:36,240
i've been having settings in the

1684
00:58:40,470 --> 00:58:37,520
recognition around

1685
00:58:42,710 --> 00:58:40,480
starting about a time when my wife was

1686
00:58:48,069 --> 00:58:42,720
diagnosed with colon cancer this was

1687
00:58:51,109 --> 00:58:48,079
in january of this past last year 2015

1688
00:58:54,950 --> 00:58:51,119
of which she succumbed to it in november

1689
00:58:57,750 --> 00:58:54,960
2015 two months ago my grandmother

1690
00:58:58,069 --> 00:58:57,760
also passed several weeks later as well

1691
00:59:03,430 --> 00:58:58,079
as

1692
00:59:06,789 --> 00:59:03,440
two of my pet dogs all within 2015.

1693
00:59:08,789 --> 00:59:06,799
do you believe that it's possible that

1694
00:59:10,230 --> 00:59:08,799
there was like a death warning or a

1695
00:59:13,510 --> 00:59:10,240
connection with me

1696
00:59:15,430 --> 00:59:13,520
starting to see these owls

1697
00:59:17,109 --> 00:59:15,440
well they okay so first let me say i'm

1698
00:59:19,109 --> 00:59:17,119
very sorry to hear your loss that's

1699
00:59:20,470 --> 00:59:19,119
it's really i didn't i didn't know that

1700
00:59:24,950 --> 00:59:20,480
at all so

1701
00:59:28,390 --> 00:59:24,960
um throughout all the mythologies

1702
00:59:32,549 --> 00:59:28,400
of the world uh owls have some

1703
00:59:33,910 --> 00:59:32,559
sort of identification with death uh

1704
00:59:35,750 --> 00:59:33,920
like the native americans in the

1705
00:59:38,870 --> 00:59:35,760
southwest in particular

1706
00:59:42,470 --> 00:59:38,880
have in mexico have a very

1707
00:59:46,230 --> 00:59:42,480
ominous folklore about the owls um

1708
00:59:47,510 --> 00:59:46,240
and death now other places um

1709
00:59:49,750 --> 00:59:47,520
you know in the norse countries

1710
00:59:53,349 --> 00:59:49,760
scandinavian countries they have

1711
00:59:55,030 --> 00:59:53,359
much less ominous accounts of

1712
00:59:56,549 --> 00:59:55,040
of owls and death but there's certainly

1713
00:59:58,390 --> 00:59:56,559
plenty of i mean

1714
01:00:00,710 --> 00:59:58,400
it's part of the lore but it's not as

1715
01:00:02,230 --> 01:00:00,720
ominous

1716
01:00:04,230 --> 01:00:02,240
i'll tell you a story from my own

1717
01:00:08,230 --> 01:00:04,240
experience so

1718
01:00:11,430 --> 01:00:08,240
my mom died

1719
01:00:13,510 --> 01:00:11,440
in 2013

1720
01:00:15,990 --> 01:00:13,520
and she had she had alzheimer's she was

1721
01:00:18,950 --> 01:00:16,000
living in an assisted living facility

1722
01:00:19,990 --> 01:00:18,960
very near my sister in north carolina

1723
01:00:22,230 --> 01:00:20,000
and

1724
01:00:23,270 --> 01:00:22,240
my brother called me up early one

1725
01:00:26,549 --> 01:00:23,280
morning and said mom

1726
01:00:27,829 --> 01:00:26,559
had an aneurysm get on a plane and i

1727
01:00:29,030 --> 01:00:27,839
knew just what he meant and i was on the

1728
01:00:32,789 --> 01:00:29,040
plane later that same

1729
01:00:33,750 --> 01:00:32,799
day uh so i flew my mom was still alive

1730
01:00:35,589 --> 01:00:33,760
and she was

1731
01:00:37,349 --> 01:00:35,599
uh you know she hadn't regained

1732
01:00:39,270 --> 01:00:37,359
consciousness and she where i think were

1733
01:00:40,630 --> 01:00:39,280
there for two or three days and then she

1734
01:00:42,230 --> 01:00:40,640
passed very early in the morning my

1735
01:00:43,030 --> 01:00:42,240
sister was there with her and i was

1736
01:00:44,230 --> 01:00:43,040
there with her

1737
01:00:46,710 --> 01:00:44,240
my brother was out of the room at the

1738
01:00:49,190 --> 01:00:46,720
time so i have one brother one sister

1739
01:00:50,549 --> 01:00:49,200
and then myself so that was my only two

1740
01:00:52,390 --> 01:00:50,559
siblings

1741
01:00:53,589 --> 01:00:52,400
my father had passed away some years

1742
01:00:55,990 --> 01:00:53,599
earlier but my mom's

1743
01:00:57,670 --> 01:00:56,000
was the last few years of her life were

1744
01:00:59,670 --> 01:00:57,680
terribly

1745
01:01:01,430 --> 01:00:59,680
sad and she was frightened and she

1746
01:01:04,470 --> 01:01:01,440
didn't understand what was happening

1747
01:01:06,309 --> 01:01:04,480
so so none of us felt it was a sad event

1748
01:01:09,349 --> 01:01:06,319
when she passed

1749
01:01:11,349 --> 01:01:09,359
uh it happened very early in the morning

1750
01:01:12,789 --> 01:01:11,359
like we had been up all night and and so

1751
01:01:14,150 --> 01:01:12,799
my brother and sister and i were all

1752
01:01:17,910 --> 01:01:14,160
kind of strung out and

1753
01:01:18,390 --> 01:01:17,920
and and trying to plan things and take

1754
01:01:21,190 --> 01:01:18,400
care of

1755
01:01:22,710 --> 01:01:21,200
you know the mundane stuff that you need

1756
01:01:25,670 --> 01:01:22,720
to deal with after this kind of thing so

1757
01:01:27,750 --> 01:01:25,680
but at the same time we were tired and

1758
01:01:29,910 --> 01:01:27,760
and trying to sleep and so but later

1759
01:01:33,190 --> 01:01:29,920
that evening

1760
01:01:36,549 --> 01:01:33,200
and i tell this in the book i i sat

1761
01:01:37,190 --> 01:01:36,559
on my sister's back porch and i was on a

1762
01:01:39,349 --> 01:01:37,200
couch

1763
01:01:40,630 --> 01:01:39,359
kind of on a you know lounge chair kind

1764
01:01:41,589 --> 01:01:40,640
of thing on the back porch with my

1765
01:01:43,030 --> 01:01:41,599
sister

1766
01:01:44,789 --> 01:01:43,040
on one side and my brother on the other

1767
01:01:48,870 --> 01:01:44,799
and i was in the middle i'm the youngest

1768
01:01:50,710 --> 01:01:48,880
i was 50 at the time um my

1769
01:01:52,390 --> 01:01:50,720
sister's friend was sitting directly

1770
01:01:54,470 --> 01:01:52,400
across from us her name is ruthie she's

1771
01:01:59,270 --> 01:01:54,480
given me permission to use her name

1772
01:02:01,349 --> 01:01:59,280
um and she looked at us

1773
01:02:03,349 --> 01:02:01,359
and that you know the situation was very

1774
01:02:05,670 --> 01:02:03,359
somber and she said i

1775
01:02:07,270 --> 01:02:05,680
know there's an afterlife i need to tell

1776
01:02:08,950 --> 01:02:07,280
you this i need to tell all of you this

1777
01:02:11,510 --> 01:02:08,960
i'm convinced i know

1778
01:02:14,470 --> 01:02:11,520
there's an afterlife and i know because

1779
01:02:16,150 --> 01:02:14,480
of an experience i had with an owl

1780
01:02:17,750 --> 01:02:16,160
now my brother and sister both knew i

1781
01:02:19,430 --> 01:02:17,760
was doing this owl research

1782
01:02:20,870 --> 01:02:19,440
and my sister was kind of like oh my god

1783
01:02:22,150 --> 01:02:20,880
an owl what what are you trying to say

1784
01:02:23,750 --> 01:02:22,160
and so and my brother kind of looked at

1785
01:02:23,990 --> 01:02:23,760
me like sideways like what is going on

1786
01:02:25,190 --> 01:02:24,000
and

1787
01:02:27,829 --> 01:02:25,200
one more what is this where did this

1788
01:02:29,510 --> 01:02:27,839
come from and um

1789
01:02:31,109 --> 01:02:29,520
and i kind of said you know ruthie

1790
01:02:32,390 --> 01:02:31,119
recognized right away that like

1791
01:02:34,549 --> 01:02:32,400
why why did this what's this weird

1792
01:02:36,230 --> 01:02:34,559
reaction i said listen i've been doing

1793
01:02:38,870 --> 01:02:36,240
this research

1794
01:02:40,950 --> 01:02:38,880
i've been researching owls what you're

1795
01:02:42,630 --> 01:02:40,960
saying is something i've heard before

1796
01:02:45,910 --> 01:02:42,640
they're related to highly charged

1797
01:02:47,270 --> 01:02:45,920
moments like death

1798
01:02:49,349 --> 01:02:47,280
and i want to hear we need to hear your

1799
01:02:51,589 --> 01:02:49,359
story so she said she had been

1800
01:02:53,109 --> 01:02:51,599
when her father had died she was

1801
01:02:55,829 --> 01:02:53,119
grieving

1802
01:02:56,630 --> 01:02:55,839
and she would walk on a path on this

1803
01:02:58,230 --> 01:02:56,640
nature walk

1804
01:03:00,470 --> 01:02:58,240
near her house is the path i've walked

1805
01:03:01,829 --> 01:03:00,480
on with my sister

1806
01:03:03,589 --> 01:03:01,839
and it loops around the neighborhood and

1807
01:03:05,670 --> 01:03:03,599
it's in the trees and

1808
01:03:07,910 --> 01:03:05,680
and uh in each day she would pass this

1809
01:03:09,109 --> 01:03:07,920
owl now she had never seen an owl before

1810
01:03:09,990 --> 01:03:09,119
she didn't know that owls would come out

1811
01:03:11,589 --> 01:03:10,000
in the day

1812
01:03:13,670 --> 01:03:11,599
so she would pass this big brown owl and

1813
01:03:15,029 --> 01:03:13,680
then one day she passed it was hooting

1814
01:03:17,220 --> 01:03:15,039
and she looked up

1815
01:03:20,150 --> 01:03:17,230
and she

1816
01:03:23,349 --> 01:03:20,160
[Music]

1817
01:03:28,309 --> 01:03:23,359
she basically asked the owl aloud

1818
01:03:30,230 --> 01:03:28,319
are you sending me news from my dad

1819
01:03:32,390 --> 01:03:30,240
and she was overcome with this complete

1820
01:03:34,710 --> 01:03:32,400
feeling of

1821
01:03:37,190 --> 01:03:34,720
peace she had been grieving she was feel

1822
01:03:38,710 --> 01:03:37,200
overwhelmed with this feeling of peace

1823
01:03:40,789 --> 01:03:38,720
the owl flew off and she never saw it

1824
01:03:44,390 --> 01:03:40,799
again and she had she had

1825
01:03:46,549 --> 01:03:44,400
you know come to some sort of closure

1826
01:03:48,789 --> 01:03:46,559
with the with the grieving that she had

1827
01:03:50,710 --> 01:03:48,799
had and it happened with this owl

1828
01:03:52,549 --> 01:03:50,720
and she even said it she said the owl

1829
01:03:54,150 --> 01:03:52,559
was there she said it straight up she

1830
01:03:55,349 --> 01:03:54,160
said the owl was there to deliver a

1831
01:04:00,230 --> 01:03:55,359
message

1832
01:04:02,630 --> 01:04:00,240
um so that is the story that i'm finding

1833
01:04:04,710 --> 01:04:02,640
um yeah that people are having these owl

1834
01:04:06,789 --> 01:04:04,720
experiences and they tend to be very

1835
01:04:08,230 --> 01:04:06,799
positive and according to some native

1836
01:04:11,109 --> 01:04:08,240
traditions

1837
01:04:13,190 --> 01:04:11,119
owls will or if you see an owl after

1838
01:04:15,430 --> 01:04:13,200
someone has died it's a sign of

1839
01:04:16,789 --> 01:04:15,440
successful passing from our world into

1840
01:04:17,910 --> 01:04:16,799
the into this better world this

1841
01:04:20,630 --> 01:04:17,920
afterlife

1842
01:04:21,750 --> 01:04:20,640
um you know and i've heard this in one

1843
01:04:24,470 --> 01:04:21,760
form or another

1844
01:04:26,390 --> 01:04:24,480
so many times at this point um and often

1845
01:04:29,670 --> 01:04:26,400
what happens is people will talk

1846
01:04:30,309 --> 01:04:29,680
to these owls as if they are their lost

1847
01:04:32,390 --> 01:04:30,319
loved ones

1848
01:04:33,990 --> 01:04:32,400
they'll talk to the owl as as if it's

1849
01:04:35,829 --> 01:04:34,000
their mother or father

1850
01:04:37,349 --> 01:04:35,839
or sibling or wife or you know i mean

1851
01:04:40,230 --> 01:04:37,359
whoever it is and

1852
01:04:42,789 --> 01:04:40,240
and they'll they'll and these are very

1853
01:04:44,870 --> 01:04:42,799
conservative

1854
01:04:46,150 --> 01:04:44,880
you know people who wouldn't step it

1855
01:04:47,589 --> 01:04:46,160
beyond the boundaries of this kind of

1856
01:04:49,990 --> 01:04:47,599
thing and they'll see an owl and then

1857
01:04:51,990 --> 01:04:50,000
say like thank you you know literally

1858
01:04:54,150 --> 01:04:52,000
i've had this one person that i'll uh

1859
01:04:57,349 --> 01:04:54,160
it's in the book

1860
01:04:57,589 --> 01:04:57,359
where an owl uh someone's mother died

1861
01:05:00,549 --> 01:04:57,599
and

1862
01:05:02,390 --> 01:05:00,559
all ended up in their garage shortly

1863
01:05:04,789 --> 01:05:02,400
after they had said i need a sign

1864
01:05:06,150 --> 01:05:04,799
to i'm i'm so i'm worried about mom you

1865
01:05:07,670 --> 01:05:06,160
know mom had died and i'm worried about

1866
01:05:08,150 --> 01:05:07,680
her i need a sign so this al shows up in

1867
01:05:10,150 --> 01:05:08,160
the garage

1868
01:05:12,630 --> 01:05:10,160
and she literally gets on the phone and

1869
01:05:14,789 --> 01:05:12,640
and talks to the owl

1870
01:05:16,950 --> 01:05:14,799
and says you know like she calls all her

1871
01:05:19,109 --> 01:05:16,960
family says you know basically mom's

1872
01:05:20,870 --> 01:05:19,119
in the garage you know i'm gonna you

1873
01:05:22,870 --> 01:05:20,880
want to say goodbye to her kind of thing

1874
01:05:24,309 --> 01:05:22,880
and then the owl wouldn't leave and then

1875
01:05:26,630 --> 01:05:24,319
finally she said listen

1876
01:05:28,069 --> 01:05:26,640
mom it's been too long you gotta go you

1877
01:05:29,750 --> 01:05:28,079
gotta leave i understand

1878
01:05:31,109 --> 01:05:29,760
the message is very clear thank you for

1879
01:05:31,750 --> 01:05:31,119
coming and saying goodbye now you have

1880
01:05:34,150 --> 01:05:31,760
to go

1881
01:05:35,190 --> 01:05:34,160
and the owl flew off so those are the

1882
01:05:36,150 --> 01:05:35,200
stories don't have anything to do with

1883
01:05:37,829 --> 01:05:36,160
ufos

1884
01:05:39,910 --> 01:05:37,839
there are normal size owls these aren't

1885
01:05:42,309 --> 01:05:39,920
four foot tall owls but this is the lore

1886
01:05:43,589 --> 01:05:42,319
this is the the mythology that is in

1887
01:05:46,710 --> 01:05:43,599
place

1888
01:05:49,349 --> 01:05:46,720
in most cultures of our planet

1889
01:05:50,870 --> 01:05:49,359
and it's playing out today in the same

1890
01:05:54,950 --> 01:05:50,880
way that it has

1891
01:05:58,390 --> 01:05:54,960
in you know ancient times well

1892
01:05:59,990 --> 01:05:58,400
you know the one connection that well i

1893
01:06:01,910 --> 01:06:00,000
don't know if it's connection but

1894
01:06:04,069 --> 01:06:01,920
the day of my grandmother's funeral

1895
01:06:07,430 --> 01:06:04,079
which was between

1896
01:06:10,069 --> 01:06:07,440
uh christmas and new year's this year

1897
01:06:12,630 --> 01:06:10,079
uh i went to i went to pennsylvania to

1898
01:06:15,109 --> 01:06:12,640
the funeral and i was talking to my dad

1899
01:06:16,710 --> 01:06:15,119
and he was telling me you know what was

1900
01:06:18,470 --> 01:06:16,720
going on i was asking how he's making

1901
01:06:20,789 --> 01:06:18,480
out and everything he said well

1902
01:06:21,910 --> 01:06:20,799
i i'd be fine but one for that damn al

1903
01:06:24,230 --> 01:06:21,920
out there in the tree

1904
01:06:25,270 --> 01:06:24,240
hooting all night long and i'm thinking

1905
01:06:28,390 --> 01:06:25,280
myself

1906
01:06:30,950 --> 01:06:28,400
oh that's interesting

1907
01:06:31,510 --> 01:06:30,960
uh i don't ever remember now being out

1908
01:06:34,309 --> 01:06:31,520
there

1909
01:06:35,109 --> 01:06:34,319
i now i asked him i said do you ever

1910
01:06:37,829 --> 01:06:35,119
remember an

1911
01:06:40,549 --> 01:06:37,839
owl being here in town or in that tree

1912
01:06:42,710 --> 01:06:40,559
or around the house right and he said no

1913
01:06:44,950 --> 01:06:42,720
they said definitely now he's i haven't

1914
01:06:48,950 --> 01:06:44,960
seen it but i've heard it

1915
01:06:50,710 --> 01:06:48,960
that is very common and if it had been

1916
01:06:52,230 --> 01:06:50,720
if he had been in a you know if we had

1917
01:06:55,190 --> 01:06:52,240
all been living in

1918
01:06:55,430 --> 01:06:55,200
you know our teepees in the village yeah

1919
01:06:59,029 --> 01:06:55,440
and

1920
01:07:02,390 --> 01:06:59,039
hooting everyone in the village

1921
01:07:03,990 --> 01:07:02,400
would recognize the deeper meaning

1922
01:07:05,589 --> 01:07:04,000
and you know we don't live in that world

1923
01:07:08,470 --> 01:07:05,599
anymore so

1924
01:07:09,029 --> 01:07:08,480
uh so i feel that that these things are

1925
01:07:11,510 --> 01:07:09,039
are

1926
01:07:13,109 --> 01:07:11,520
struggling to emerge and make themselves

1927
01:07:15,910 --> 01:07:13,119
known and sometimes we recognize them

1928
01:07:17,670 --> 01:07:15,920
and sometimes we don't

1929
01:07:20,069 --> 01:07:17,680
the you know i have one story that was

1930
01:07:22,150 --> 01:07:20,079
told to me it's not in the book

1931
01:07:23,349 --> 01:07:22,160
it's a woman who's a ufo researcher she

1932
01:07:26,630 --> 01:07:23,359
said her

1933
01:07:29,670 --> 01:07:26,640
father was dying i think this is right

1934
01:07:30,710 --> 01:07:29,680
and her mother had already died uh some

1935
01:07:32,950 --> 01:07:30,720
years before

1936
01:07:34,470 --> 01:07:32,960
and as literally like they're they're

1937
01:07:37,029 --> 01:07:34,480
holding in the hospice care

1938
01:07:40,309 --> 01:07:37,039
in the house in the house they lived in

1939
01:07:43,670 --> 01:07:40,319
there's a owl hooting out the window

1940
01:07:46,630 --> 01:07:43,680
and hooting away this is as the

1941
01:07:48,069 --> 01:07:46,640
as the father is passing and they're

1942
01:07:50,069 --> 01:07:48,079
holding his hand he takes his last

1943
01:07:52,069 --> 01:07:50,079
breath as soon as he dies as soon as he

1944
01:07:55,990 --> 01:07:52,079
takes his last breath his heart stops

1945
01:07:57,910 --> 01:07:56,000
there's two owls outside hooting

1946
01:07:59,750 --> 01:07:57,920
and this is everyone in the family said

1947
01:08:03,029 --> 01:07:59,760
exactly the same thing

1948
01:08:05,910 --> 01:08:03,039
that was that was mom outside

1949
01:08:06,870 --> 01:08:05,920
calling dad and then when dad left his

1950
01:08:10,150 --> 01:08:06,880
body

1951
01:08:15,349 --> 01:08:10,160
you know he that he became that other

1952
01:08:17,910 --> 01:08:16,550
you know i don't know if that's i don't

1953
01:08:19,590 --> 01:08:17,920
know if that's actually what's playing

1954
01:08:22,390 --> 01:08:19,600
out but that is certainly

1955
01:08:23,990 --> 01:08:22,400
what brought solace and a sense of peace

1956
01:08:26,309 --> 01:08:24,000
to everyone in that room

1957
01:08:27,829 --> 01:08:26,319
you know uh you know it's interesting

1958
01:08:29,430 --> 01:08:27,839
because

1959
01:08:31,669 --> 01:08:29,440
you know i was telling colleagues and

1960
01:08:32,229 --> 01:08:31,679
all i told sean as well and another

1961
01:08:34,390 --> 01:08:32,239
friend

1962
01:08:36,149 --> 01:08:34,400
and a lot of people that were reading my

1963
01:08:37,669 --> 01:08:36,159
blog that you know i've been i kept

1964
01:08:40,309 --> 01:08:37,679
getting these

1965
01:08:42,309 --> 01:08:40,319
these owl signs i'd see it now or i'd

1966
01:08:42,789 --> 01:08:42,319
see something pertaining out or somebody

1967
01:08:45,829 --> 01:08:42,799
would

1968
01:08:46,789 --> 01:08:45,839
mention something about it now i had

1969
01:08:50,870 --> 01:08:46,799
just started some

1970
01:08:52,870 --> 01:08:50,880
shamanic journeying at that time and

1971
01:08:55,910 --> 01:08:52,880
when i learned that a power my power

1972
01:08:57,990 --> 01:08:55,920
animal was a great horn now

1973
01:08:59,910 --> 01:08:58,000
uh i had a friend who's actually a

1974
01:09:03,349 --> 01:08:59,920
navajo shaman

1975
01:09:06,550 --> 01:09:03,359
who told me that the owl or the

1976
01:09:07,510 --> 01:09:06,560
great horned out was my power animal not

1977
01:09:08,950 --> 01:09:07,520
knowing that i had

1978
01:09:11,189 --> 01:09:08,960
done any of this with the shamanic

1979
01:09:14,789 --> 01:09:11,199
journey as well

1980
01:09:17,829 --> 01:09:14,799
lakota shaman several years ago

1981
01:09:19,590 --> 01:09:17,839
mentioned it to me though i never really

1982
01:09:23,430 --> 01:09:19,600
thought much about it

1983
01:09:26,870 --> 01:09:23,440
and in the last on the last

1984
01:09:30,070 --> 01:09:26,880
five or six years i have received

1985
01:09:32,789 --> 01:09:30,080
three al totems as gifts from three

1986
01:09:34,789 --> 01:09:32,799
different people

1987
01:09:36,630 --> 01:09:34,799
not knowing there being a connection or

1988
01:09:37,669 --> 01:09:36,640
anything i mean i was told by the shaman

1989
01:09:39,510 --> 01:09:37,679
that the owl

1990
01:09:42,550 --> 01:09:39,520
was usually a female you know

1991
01:09:44,709 --> 01:09:42,560
represented female mystic power

1992
01:09:45,829 --> 01:09:44,719
though that mystic males can also be

1993
01:09:48,309 --> 01:09:45,839
connected

1994
01:09:49,110 --> 01:09:48,319
now i don't know how true that is i i

1995
01:09:52,789 --> 01:09:49,120
know in their

1996
01:09:54,630 --> 01:09:52,799
their lore that's what it is yeah

1997
01:09:56,229 --> 01:09:54,640
so oh this is interesting oh god this

1998
01:09:57,830 --> 01:09:56,239
book is you should joke i'm glad you're

1999
01:10:00,470 --> 01:09:57,840
reading the book this book is free

2000
01:10:02,070 --> 01:10:00,480
basically i told sean yeah i said this

2001
01:10:03,910 --> 01:10:02,080
book was great for me

2002
01:10:05,270 --> 01:10:03,920
i mean i you know i started reading as

2003
01:10:07,990 --> 01:10:05,280
soon as i heard about it

2004
01:10:09,030 --> 01:10:08,000
and uh it's all there's a lot of uh

2005
01:10:10,709 --> 01:10:09,040
there's gonna be a lot of reference

2006
01:10:13,270 --> 01:10:10,719
material in there and in fact you're

2007
01:10:14,550 --> 01:10:13,280
you are writing another book are you not

2008
01:10:14,870 --> 01:10:14,560
i'm working on another book right now

2009
01:10:18,149 --> 01:10:14,880
and

2010
01:10:20,790 --> 01:10:18,159
what happened was the um the

2011
01:10:22,229 --> 01:10:20,800
stories i had collected i had too many

2012
01:10:22,709 --> 01:10:22,239
of them i mean they're too many you know

2013
01:10:24,790 --> 01:10:22,719
like

2014
01:10:26,550 --> 01:10:24,800
the books nearly 400 pages long it was

2015
01:10:27,990 --> 01:10:26,560
kind of a mistake in some ways to make a

2016
01:10:31,750 --> 01:10:28,000
book that long it's a little

2017
01:10:34,390 --> 01:10:31,760
intimidating to pick up but um

2018
01:10:35,030 --> 01:10:34,400
you know so i had all these long stories

2019
01:10:37,830 --> 01:10:35,040
you know it's

2020
01:10:38,149 --> 01:10:37,840
some of these stories that people have

2021
01:10:40,390 --> 01:10:38,159
are

2022
01:10:42,149 --> 01:10:40,400
they have a kind of um i almost want to

2023
01:10:42,630 --> 01:10:42,159
say like a dream logic to them you know

2024
01:10:45,030 --> 01:10:42,640
they just

2025
01:10:46,630 --> 01:10:45,040
get long and then there's you pull on

2026
01:10:47,750 --> 01:10:46,640
one little thread and there's little

2027
01:10:51,669 --> 01:10:47,760
threads that go off

2028
01:10:52,630 --> 01:10:51,679
everywhere uh as if as if every little

2029
01:10:59,189 --> 01:10:52,640
clue

2030
01:11:02,070 --> 01:10:59,199
um and so i couldn't just

2031
01:11:02,950 --> 01:11:02,080
you know write these stories off as um

2032
01:11:05,430 --> 01:11:02,960
as uh

2033
01:11:06,310 --> 01:11:05,440
uh you know like a couple sentences you

2034
01:11:07,750 --> 01:11:06,320
know like you know here's the

2035
01:11:08,870 --> 01:11:07,760
interesting part of this really long

2036
01:11:10,229 --> 01:11:08,880
story i'm gonna sum it up in two

2037
01:11:11,750 --> 01:11:10,239
sentences that would have been unfair to

2038
01:11:13,510 --> 01:11:11,760
everyone involved in these stories

2039
01:11:15,030 --> 01:11:13,520
so i kind of kept those it was one point

2040
01:11:16,390 --> 01:11:15,040
i thought i'll just put an appendix in

2041
01:11:17,990 --> 01:11:16,400
and just have these long stories at the

2042
01:11:19,910 --> 01:11:18,000
end and that didn't work at all

2043
01:11:21,669 --> 01:11:19,920
um so there's going to be a follow-up

2044
01:11:23,590 --> 01:11:21,679
book and the working titles is stories

2045
01:11:25,030 --> 01:11:23,600
from the messengers and a companion book

2046
01:11:27,270 --> 01:11:25,040
to the to the main book

2047
01:11:28,790 --> 01:11:27,280
and it'll read like a collection of

2048
01:11:30,149 --> 01:11:28,800
short stories it'll just be a short

2049
01:11:34,070 --> 01:11:30,159
stories

2050
01:11:35,189 --> 01:11:34,080
book now

2051
01:11:37,350 --> 01:11:35,199
there's a couple in there that are kind

2052
01:11:37,990 --> 01:11:37,360
of long but i and some of those are mine

2053
01:11:40,310 --> 01:11:38,000
but

2054
01:11:41,669 --> 01:11:40,320
um owen as far as the owl being uh

2055
01:11:45,590 --> 01:11:41,679
feminine energy that's

2056
01:11:48,630 --> 01:11:45,600
kind of oh that's a more european

2057
01:11:48,950 --> 01:11:48,640
notion in a lot of ways or or uh but but

2058
01:11:57,110 --> 01:11:48,960
the

2059
01:11:59,590 --> 01:11:57,120
dominant

2060
01:12:02,149 --> 01:11:59,600
daylight bird totem right now zeus you

2061
01:12:06,149 --> 01:12:02,159
know sat on his throne a man and he

2062
01:12:09,510 --> 01:12:06,159
had um uh you know an eagle as his totem

2063
01:12:11,990 --> 01:12:09,520
um athena uh you know

2064
01:12:12,790 --> 01:12:12,000
the night the moon the moon is symbolic

2065
01:12:15,030 --> 01:12:12,800
of the of the

2066
01:12:16,149 --> 01:12:15,040
you know the the feminine cycle the 28

2067
01:12:18,630 --> 01:12:16,159
day cycle

2068
01:12:19,350 --> 01:12:18,640
um so the night time the moon the

2069
01:12:22,630 --> 01:12:19,360
mystical

2070
01:12:25,750 --> 01:12:22,640
is much more of a feminine energy than

2071
01:12:28,709 --> 01:12:25,760
the masculine power energy of of

2072
01:12:29,510 --> 01:12:28,719
you know conquest and and uh you know

2073
01:12:32,390 --> 01:12:29,520
sort of the

2074
01:12:34,310 --> 01:12:32,400
the the the god of zeus kind of thing so

2075
01:12:36,229 --> 01:12:34,320
yes so those so

2076
01:12:37,510 --> 01:12:36,239
and i guess that also goes back to the

2077
01:12:40,870 --> 01:12:37,520
uh

2078
01:12:43,189 --> 01:12:40,880
such

2079
01:12:44,709 --> 01:12:43,199
where she was represented in the uh and

2080
01:12:46,070 --> 01:12:44,719
i forget the name of the relief but it

2081
01:12:47,990 --> 01:12:46,080
had the two owls in it

2082
01:12:49,669 --> 01:12:48,000
yeah the bernie relief yeah yeah which

2083
01:12:51,669 --> 01:12:49,679
is which as i saw him i went to

2084
01:12:52,790 --> 01:12:51,679
england a couple of summers ago and it's

2085
01:12:54,070 --> 01:12:52,800
really small there's this

2086
01:12:55,350 --> 01:12:54,080
little clay tablet and it's funny

2087
01:12:56,149 --> 01:12:55,360
because if you do what i do which is you

2088
01:12:58,630 --> 01:12:56,159
know you google

2089
01:13:00,310 --> 01:12:58,640
ufos mythology yeah the first thing you

2090
01:13:01,510 --> 01:13:00,320
get all this the same stuff come

2091
01:13:04,149 --> 01:13:01,520
over and over again and one of them is

2092
01:13:06,310 --> 01:13:04,159
this thing this this clay tablet from

2093
01:13:08,229 --> 01:13:06,320
and it's it's uh you know it's funny

2094
01:13:09,669 --> 01:13:08,239
because it's like a

2095
01:13:11,270 --> 01:13:09,679
no one really knows the source of this

2096
01:13:13,750 --> 01:13:11,280
tablet so it's just this kind of

2097
01:13:15,590 --> 01:13:13,760
rorschach test and like everything comes

2098
01:13:19,270 --> 01:13:15,600
up it could be this it could be that

2099
01:13:22,070 --> 01:13:19,280
it's but it's a it's a woman with owls

2100
01:13:22,709 --> 01:13:22,080
she has a owl feet talon's his feet and

2101
01:13:26,149 --> 01:13:22,719
she's got

2102
01:13:28,310 --> 01:13:26,159
uh an owl right and left of her um

2103
01:13:29,590 --> 01:13:28,320
and she's uh standing by two lions and

2104
01:13:32,550 --> 01:13:29,600
stuff like this beautiful little

2105
01:13:34,790 --> 01:13:32,560
terracotta thing and and um but it's not

2106
01:13:37,110 --> 01:13:34,800
very big and it's just it's uh

2107
01:13:38,950 --> 01:13:37,120
yeah so that that one piece yeah lilith

2108
01:13:40,390 --> 01:13:38,960
and lilith was a

2109
01:13:42,550 --> 01:13:40,400
you know kind of a blurring between a

2110
01:13:43,750 --> 01:13:42,560
vampire and a witch and shape-shifted

2111
01:13:45,669 --> 01:13:43,760
into an owl at night

2112
01:13:47,430 --> 01:13:45,679
so you know perfect you know monster

2113
01:13:49,750 --> 01:13:47,440
movie demon in a way

2114
01:13:52,310 --> 01:13:49,760
yeah well i guess in the uh in the

2115
01:13:55,110 --> 01:13:52,320
hebrew sense it was the actual first

2116
01:13:57,750 --> 01:13:55,120
woman that the first woman in the garden

2117
01:13:59,350 --> 01:13:57,760
of eden that turned into the demon

2118
01:14:00,709 --> 01:13:59,360
depending on the scriptures you've read

2119
01:14:02,550 --> 01:14:00,719
yeah i mean there's these different

2120
01:14:06,550 --> 01:14:02,560
versions of the old testament yeah

2121
01:14:10,550 --> 01:14:06,560
yeah it's interesting very interesting

2122
01:14:12,470 --> 01:14:10,560
i guess my question for mike is you know

2123
01:14:15,270 --> 01:14:12,480
what prompted you to write the book what

2124
01:14:16,630 --> 01:14:15,280
was your did you have a focus for this

2125
01:14:17,990 --> 01:14:16,640
you i mean you spent a lot of time

2126
01:14:20,870 --> 01:14:18,000
gathering the stories

2127
01:14:22,630 --> 01:14:20,880
what was the purpose for you to write it

2128
01:14:24,149 --> 01:14:22,640
well you know what happened was i was

2129
01:14:25,750 --> 01:14:24,159
collecting these stories and i just

2130
01:14:27,110 --> 01:14:25,760
started collecting them and i had a blog

2131
01:14:27,990 --> 01:14:27,120
and i would write them down and i would

2132
01:14:29,990 --> 01:14:28,000
share these stories

2133
01:14:31,189 --> 01:14:30,000
and i was writing down my own stories so

2134
01:14:32,470 --> 01:14:31,199
people would tell me a story and i'd

2135
01:14:33,910 --> 01:14:32,480
just make an effort to write it and some

2136
01:14:35,350 --> 01:14:33,920
of those are in the blog as

2137
01:14:37,030 --> 01:14:35,360
as actual blog posts you know they're

2138
01:14:39,669 --> 01:14:37,040
nice if you you know whatever couple

2139
01:14:41,510 --> 01:14:39,679
typewritten pages

2140
01:14:43,669 --> 01:14:41,520
and then it was the summer of it was

2141
01:14:46,550 --> 01:14:43,679
actually while my mom

2142
01:14:47,030 --> 01:14:46,560
was dying and it was right at that time

2143
01:14:50,070 --> 01:14:47,040
my

2144
01:14:51,189 --> 01:14:50,080
was uh i was working on this essay so i

2145
01:14:53,110 --> 01:14:51,199
wrote an essay

2146
01:14:55,189 --> 01:14:53,120
that's it's on the online in the blog

2147
01:14:56,550 --> 01:14:55,199
it's called owls in the ufo abductee

2148
01:14:59,990 --> 01:14:56,560
it's about

2149
01:15:01,669 --> 01:15:00,000
35 pages long printed out and that

2150
01:15:03,270 --> 01:15:01,679
and when i wrote that up and i treated

2151
01:15:03,830 --> 01:15:03,280
it really seriously i really tried to

2152
01:15:07,110 --> 01:15:03,840
write a

2153
01:15:10,149 --> 01:15:07,120
very competent serious minded

2154
01:15:13,030 --> 01:15:10,159
account of of uh you know

2155
01:15:15,510 --> 01:15:13,040
this overlap between owls and and the

2156
01:15:19,030 --> 01:15:15,520
ufo contact experience

2157
01:15:23,030 --> 01:15:19,040
and as soon as i finished that

2158
01:15:25,189 --> 01:15:23,040
i realized uh uh this has to be its own

2159
01:15:26,950 --> 01:15:25,199
book and you know actually a few people

2160
01:15:27,430 --> 01:15:26,960
commented right away like wow this

2161
01:15:29,830 --> 01:15:27,440
you've got

2162
01:15:31,350 --> 01:15:29,840
this is a book waiting to happen and i

2163
01:15:33,189 --> 01:15:31,360
knew it full on and so so i

2164
01:15:34,790 --> 01:15:33,199
so then it was just like oh gosh now i

2165
01:15:35,990 --> 01:15:34,800
what i made the terrible mistake of just

2166
01:15:37,669 --> 01:15:36,000
kind of like writing

2167
01:15:39,030 --> 01:15:37,679
just writing you know someone's got an

2168
01:15:40,470 --> 01:15:39,040
owl story i'll write it up as a long

2169
01:15:41,510 --> 01:15:40,480
essay and you can kind of sense a little

2170
01:15:43,030 --> 01:15:41,520
bit at that in there these

2171
01:15:44,870 --> 01:15:43,040
little sub chapters that kind of stand

2172
01:15:47,510 --> 01:15:44,880
alone um

2173
01:15:49,030 --> 01:15:47,520
but uh at a certain point in the middle

2174
01:15:51,270 --> 01:15:49,040
of it i just was like

2175
01:15:52,470 --> 01:15:51,280
i was just drowning in these stories and

2176
01:15:53,910 --> 01:15:52,480
i didn't know you know how to

2177
01:15:55,910 --> 01:15:53,920
make sense of them and it took a long

2178
01:15:57,510 --> 01:15:55,920
time for me to kind of

2179
01:15:59,590 --> 01:15:57,520
put them in some sort of order and some

2180
01:15:59,990 --> 01:15:59,600
sort of progression so that reader could

2181
01:16:01,990 --> 01:16:00,000
be

2182
01:16:03,270 --> 01:16:02,000
pulled along yep so that was my impetus

2183
01:16:07,590 --> 01:16:03,280
to write the thing and

2184
01:16:09,270 --> 01:16:07,600
quite honestly i was awash in so many

2185
01:16:10,229 --> 01:16:09,280
synchronicities during the writing

2186
01:16:13,669 --> 01:16:10,239
process

2187
01:16:16,630 --> 01:16:13,679
that it was like the the cosmic

2188
01:16:17,590 --> 01:16:16,640
forces of reality were prodding me like

2189
01:16:19,830 --> 01:16:17,600
to to

2190
01:16:21,270 --> 01:16:19,840
to proceed forward you know like i would

2191
01:16:22,470 --> 01:16:21,280
get just the perfect story at just the

2192
01:16:24,229 --> 01:16:22,480
perfect time you know

2193
01:16:25,990 --> 01:16:24,239
it was it was a really amazing process

2194
01:16:27,430 --> 01:16:26,000
to work on the book

2195
01:16:29,350 --> 01:16:27,440
you know there was a there's another

2196
01:16:32,470 --> 01:16:29,360
phenomenon that

2197
01:16:34,390 --> 01:16:32,480
uh i i think you maybe

2198
01:16:35,910 --> 01:16:34,400
found out or discovered why you were

2199
01:16:37,910 --> 01:16:35,920
writing a book was

2200
01:16:39,510 --> 01:16:37,920
how many of the incidents happened to

2201
01:16:42,149 --> 01:16:39,520
people named chris

2202
01:16:42,550 --> 01:16:42,159
and in fact i i know two of the people

2203
01:16:45,430 --> 01:16:42,560
uh

2204
01:16:47,030 --> 01:16:45,440
chris bledsoe and chris holly who were

2205
01:16:49,990 --> 01:16:47,040
in the book

2206
01:16:51,350 --> 01:16:50,000
that just seems very strange to me you

2207
01:16:52,149 --> 01:16:51,360
know it's funny because i don't have i

2208
01:16:53,669 --> 01:16:52,159
mean chris is

2209
01:16:55,830 --> 01:16:53,679
obviously a common name so then there's

2210
01:16:57,750 --> 01:16:55,840
this story started with kristin

2211
01:16:59,510 --> 01:16:57,760
um there's the people you know like so i

2212
01:17:01,189 --> 01:16:59,520
just you know like i didn't i didn't

2213
01:17:01,590 --> 01:17:01,199
took me a while to kind of figure it out

2214
01:17:08,390 --> 01:17:01,600
and

2215
01:17:10,709 --> 01:17:08,400
like like a like a tidy spreadsheet

2216
01:17:12,870 --> 01:17:10,719
of all the names you know to formal

2217
01:17:15,910 --> 01:17:12,880
breakdown like if i was doing you know

2218
01:17:17,510 --> 01:17:15,920
you know if someone at a college wanted

2219
01:17:20,310 --> 01:17:17,520
me to research this i would be

2220
01:17:22,149 --> 01:17:20,320
you know confined in to be that

2221
01:17:23,669 --> 01:17:22,159
strictness the way i documented this

2222
01:17:26,229 --> 01:17:23,679
stuff i don't have any of that

2223
01:17:26,870 --> 01:17:26,239
um but what i just noticed is oh my god

2224
01:17:28,229 --> 01:17:26,880
these people

2225
01:17:30,310 --> 01:17:28,239
you know when i noticed it actually this

2226
01:17:33,350 --> 01:17:30,320
one story in the book about a woman who

2227
01:17:33,669 --> 01:17:33,360
took mushrooms and and her boyfriend got

2228
01:17:36,229 --> 01:17:33,679
his

2229
01:17:38,709 --> 01:17:36,239
hat knocked off by an owl as they were

2230
01:17:40,630 --> 01:17:38,719
just about to step into a herd of bison

2231
01:17:41,750 --> 01:17:40,640
in yellowstone national park in the dark

2232
01:17:43,270 --> 01:17:41,760
and and

2233
01:17:44,950 --> 01:17:43,280
so she's like you know all saved our

2234
01:17:45,430 --> 01:17:44,960
lives you know you know which is i mean

2235
01:17:48,229 --> 01:17:45,440
a little

2236
01:17:49,830 --> 01:17:48,239
overkill maybe but definitely they they

2237
01:17:51,830 --> 01:17:49,840
were stepping into a dangerous situation

2238
01:17:53,590 --> 01:17:51,840
and owl basically knocked his hat off

2239
01:17:55,270 --> 01:17:53,600
now this is actually not uncommon for

2240
01:17:56,950 --> 01:17:55,280
owls to knock people's hats off it gets

2241
01:17:59,990 --> 01:17:56,960
reported all the time

2242
01:18:01,669 --> 01:18:00,000
um but his name was chris

2243
01:18:03,030 --> 01:18:01,679
and she also told me it was not in the

2244
01:18:04,310 --> 01:18:03,040
book it's basically it's not as

2245
01:18:04,870 --> 01:18:04,320
interesting as the other story but she

2246
01:18:06,390 --> 01:18:04,880
had been

2247
01:18:08,310 --> 01:18:06,400
had another owl experience with another

2248
01:18:10,630 --> 01:18:08,320
boyfriend a completely different person

2249
01:18:13,030 --> 01:18:10,640
but his name was also chris

2250
01:18:14,470 --> 01:18:13,040
so i was like chris chris and i from

2251
01:18:15,910 --> 01:18:14,480
that point on i was like

2252
01:18:17,590 --> 01:18:15,920
there's these names it's popping up

2253
01:18:20,630 --> 01:18:17,600
everywhere you know it's not

2254
01:18:21,990 --> 01:18:20,640
it's statistically whatever it's

2255
01:18:24,149 --> 01:18:22,000
it's unusual that there's that many

2256
01:18:27,590 --> 01:18:24,159
chris's yeah

2257
01:18:29,189 --> 01:18:27,600
you know now we we have about 10 minutes

2258
01:18:30,870 --> 01:18:29,199
left but i'll tell you that and the one

2259
01:18:31,990 --> 01:18:30,880
the one thing i i would like you to

2260
01:18:34,630 --> 01:18:32,000
touch on

2261
01:18:35,270 --> 01:18:34,640
was the dolores colorado natasha and

2262
01:18:37,910 --> 01:18:35,280
navajo

2263
01:18:39,750 --> 01:18:37,920
shaman incidents uh that you have in the

2264
01:18:41,510 --> 01:18:39,760
back of the book and it basically gets

2265
01:18:43,669 --> 01:18:41,520
confirmed your confirmation

2266
01:18:44,630 --> 01:18:43,679
what was your confirmation of the al ufo

2267
01:18:46,070 --> 01:18:44,640
connection

2268
01:18:47,669 --> 01:18:46,080
can you kind of explain a little bit

2269
01:18:49,590 --> 01:18:47,679
what happened to you

2270
01:18:51,189 --> 01:18:49,600
hey yeah okay this is this is a big

2271
01:18:53,110 --> 01:18:51,199
story this takes

2272
01:18:54,870 --> 01:18:53,120
like 30 pages to tell this properly and

2273
01:18:58,070 --> 01:18:54,880
i got need pictures so

2274
01:19:01,750 --> 01:18:58,080
uh so

2275
01:19:05,189 --> 01:19:01,760
that there's so i had us

2276
01:19:06,550 --> 01:19:05,199
i'll try to tell this quickly so i had

2277
01:19:08,550 --> 01:19:06,560
except on the side of the road coming

2278
01:19:10,070 --> 01:19:08,560
home from a ufo convention and saw this

2279
01:19:11,590 --> 01:19:10,080
thing in a hill a bunch of odd things

2280
01:19:13,750 --> 01:19:11,600
were connected with us including a

2281
01:19:15,669 --> 01:19:13,760
coyote howling right next to me now

2282
01:19:17,189 --> 01:19:15,679
i started these things that i worked

2283
01:19:18,470 --> 01:19:17,199
outside so it's very common for me to

2284
01:19:21,669 --> 01:19:18,480
sleep out under the stars

2285
01:19:24,950 --> 01:19:21,679
southern utah and it's cold it was march

2286
01:19:26,550 --> 01:19:24,960
and um and a totally glorious clear

2287
01:19:27,990 --> 01:19:26,560
night and i just love it i love that

2288
01:19:29,830 --> 01:19:28,000
kind of thing so i'm sleeping out

2289
01:19:31,189 --> 01:19:29,840
under the stars and i see this up in

2290
01:19:33,430 --> 01:19:31,199
this hilltop i look up there and i said

2291
01:19:34,870 --> 01:19:33,440
that looks just like a landed flying

2292
01:19:36,630 --> 01:19:34,880
saucer

2293
01:19:38,229 --> 01:19:36,640
and i think to myself listen i'm like

2294
01:19:40,470 --> 01:19:38,239
whatever like i've got like my own

2295
01:19:42,149 --> 01:19:40,480
psychic mojo like i'd know right if that

2296
01:19:42,630 --> 01:19:42,159
was like a flying saucer i would know it

2297
01:19:44,550 --> 01:19:42,640
wouldn't i

2298
01:19:46,310 --> 01:19:44,560
like feel it in my bones or something

2299
01:19:48,470 --> 01:19:46,320
and i looked up at this thing nothing

2300
01:19:50,470 --> 01:19:48,480
nothing as bland as it could be so i'm

2301
01:19:51,830 --> 01:19:50,480
like okay so somebody's house is up

2302
01:19:52,630 --> 01:19:51,840
there on that hillside then this is way

2303
01:19:54,070 --> 01:19:52,640
out in dusty

2304
01:19:56,870 --> 01:19:54,080
utah there's nothing that much around

2305
01:19:58,149 --> 01:19:56,880
there so i um

2306
01:19:59,990 --> 01:19:58,159
got up the next morning drove home and

2307
01:20:01,510 --> 01:20:00,000
it really bugged me

2308
01:20:03,510 --> 01:20:01,520
so i looked up on google maps and was

2309
01:20:05,110 --> 01:20:03,520
nothing you know there would if there

2310
01:20:06,390 --> 01:20:05,120
was a big house there and i

2311
01:20:07,990 --> 01:20:06,400
figured out where i was sleeping and

2312
01:20:10,470 --> 01:20:08,000
where the only spot it could have been

2313
01:20:13,590 --> 01:20:10,480
and i'm good with maps and it was 1.6

2314
01:20:17,030 --> 01:20:13,600
miles away so whatever i saw was big

2315
01:20:19,270 --> 01:20:17,040
and uh and then i

2316
01:20:21,189 --> 01:20:19,280
at that point i i had what i can only

2317
01:20:22,070 --> 01:20:21,199
call a psychic flash and i saw this map

2318
01:20:25,270 --> 01:20:22,080
in my mind with

2319
01:20:27,270 --> 01:20:25,280
three dots on this map a perfectly

2320
01:20:31,430 --> 01:20:27,280
straight line

2321
01:20:35,270 --> 01:20:31,440
now the one dot on the westernmost side

2322
01:20:36,790 --> 01:20:35,280
of the map or the or the left side

2323
01:20:38,870 --> 01:20:36,800
would have been that event that i just

2324
01:20:40,229 --> 01:20:38,880
stole with uh with a round structure on

2325
01:20:43,270 --> 01:20:40,239
the top of the hill

2326
01:20:44,550 --> 01:20:43,280
on the and i knew exactly what was on

2327
01:20:46,709 --> 01:20:44,560
the eastern side and that would have

2328
01:20:48,550 --> 01:20:46,719
been in dolores colorado

2329
01:20:50,550 --> 01:20:48,560
and i was camping with a friend of mine

2330
01:20:54,310 --> 01:20:50,560
her name is natasha

2331
01:20:54,629 --> 01:20:54,320
and um i had met her to ufo convention

2332
01:20:57,830 --> 01:20:54,639
and

2333
01:20:59,910 --> 01:20:57,840
should be very careful what i say

2334
01:21:01,669 --> 01:20:59,920
she's very cautious how she describes

2335
01:21:03,270 --> 01:21:01,679
her own experiences but she would fall

2336
01:21:04,629 --> 01:21:03,280
into the category of let's say maybe

2337
01:21:06,229 --> 01:21:04,639
people where

2338
01:21:07,669 --> 01:21:06,239
maybe she's had some weird stuff happen

2339
01:21:09,110 --> 01:21:07,679
in her life she'll agree with that right

2340
01:21:10,390 --> 01:21:09,120
away and some of the stuff has to do

2341
01:21:13,590 --> 01:21:10,400
with ufos

2342
01:21:14,870 --> 01:21:13,600
so uh we're sleeping in a tent and wake

2343
01:21:15,750 --> 01:21:14,880
up in the middle of the night both of us

2344
01:21:20,070 --> 01:21:15,760
screaming

2345
01:21:21,510 --> 01:21:20,080
i've worked outside a lot and i've spent

2346
01:21:21,910 --> 01:21:21,520
a lot of nights in tents and i know just

2347
01:21:24,790 --> 01:21:21,920
what

2348
01:21:25,510 --> 01:21:24,800
it means to have i mean i've never felt

2349
01:21:27,430 --> 01:21:25,520
this scared

2350
01:21:29,510 --> 01:21:27,440
ever you know we're at this little

2351
01:21:30,950 --> 01:21:29,520
campsite like near a little road and

2352
01:21:32,390 --> 01:21:30,960
everything like that i mean i've camped

2353
01:21:34,149 --> 01:21:32,400
in grizzly bear country and never been

2354
01:21:37,669 --> 01:21:34,159
as scared as i was at that moment

2355
01:21:40,709 --> 01:21:37,679
um so uh this lasts like

2356
01:21:42,550 --> 01:21:40,719
10 minutes and poof we're both asleep

2357
01:21:43,990 --> 01:21:42,560
uh you know so we went from absolutely

2358
01:21:45,590 --> 01:21:44,000
panic to poof being asleep and the next

2359
01:21:46,870 --> 01:21:45,600
thing i know this is now this is it's

2360
01:21:48,790 --> 01:21:46,880
very dream like

2361
01:21:50,390 --> 01:21:48,800
i mean it wasn't a dream but it's dream

2362
01:21:51,030 --> 01:21:50,400
like and i'm then i'm floating out of

2363
01:21:55,990 --> 01:21:51,040
the

2364
01:21:58,149 --> 01:21:56,000
up in this white realm and i have that

2365
01:22:00,390 --> 01:21:58,159
elevator up feeling as i'm floating and

2366
01:22:01,830 --> 01:22:00,400
this is just there's so much weird stuff

2367
01:22:03,910 --> 01:22:01,840
connected to this and

2368
01:22:05,270 --> 01:22:03,920
and then uh you know i'm saying i have

2369
01:22:06,390 --> 01:22:05,280
to remember this i have to remember this

2370
01:22:08,870 --> 01:22:06,400
the next thing i'm saying is

2371
01:22:09,990 --> 01:22:08,880
am i on a table am i on a table i don't

2372
01:22:11,830 --> 01:22:10,000
have any memories at

2373
01:22:14,070 --> 01:22:11,840
all of being on a table but i do clearly

2374
01:22:16,070 --> 01:22:14,080
remember saying that

2375
01:22:17,590 --> 01:22:16,080
and the next thing i know is i'm back in

2376
01:22:19,990 --> 01:22:17,600
my tent and then

2377
01:22:20,870 --> 01:22:20,000
it's the next morning and and i you know

2378
01:22:23,189 --> 01:22:20,880
i'm like

2379
01:22:24,870 --> 01:22:23,199
what happened last night what happened

2380
01:22:26,310 --> 01:22:24,880
she's like i don't know and it was just

2381
01:22:27,590 --> 01:22:26,320
weird stuff that she remembered and

2382
01:22:28,790 --> 01:22:27,600
weird stuff that i remembered i got out

2383
01:22:30,310 --> 01:22:28,800
of the tent and i walked around

2384
01:22:31,750 --> 01:22:30,320
and i was looking for a burn mark or

2385
01:22:33,030 --> 01:22:31,760
something and then where ufo had landed

2386
01:22:34,870 --> 01:22:33,040
i didn't find anything

2387
01:22:36,310 --> 01:22:34,880
totally calm beautiful morning birds are

2388
01:22:39,350 --> 01:22:36,320
chirping and just

2389
01:22:42,149 --> 01:22:39,360
normal and then uh

2390
01:22:43,750 --> 01:22:42,159
i'm later on that day i take my shirt

2391
01:22:45,030 --> 01:22:43,760
off and i have this big scratch

2392
01:22:47,350 --> 01:22:45,040
it goes from my left shoulder to my

2393
01:22:49,270 --> 01:22:47,360
belly button and it looks like a

2394
01:22:52,070 --> 01:22:49,280
cat claw like a single cat claw a single

2395
01:22:54,790 --> 01:22:52,080
rose thorn had scratched me

2396
01:22:55,830 --> 01:22:54,800
but when you looked at it really closely

2397
01:23:03,510 --> 01:22:55,840
it was a

2398
01:23:06,070 --> 01:23:03,520
itty-bitty blisters these little tiny

2399
01:23:09,510 --> 01:23:06,080
blisters all lined up in a row

2400
01:23:14,070 --> 01:23:12,310
so in in they healed up in a few days i

2401
01:23:16,550 --> 01:23:14,080
took a shower and they washed off

2402
01:23:19,030 --> 01:23:16,560
now leading up to this whole thing we

2403
01:23:21,510 --> 01:23:19,040
were trapped in dolores colorado

2404
01:23:22,550 --> 01:23:21,520
because my car broke down my car broke

2405
01:23:24,470 --> 01:23:22,560
down i had this

2406
01:23:26,070 --> 01:23:24,480
old subaru and it was just acting a

2407
01:23:26,709 --> 01:23:26,080
little funny where i pulled into this

2408
01:23:28,310 --> 01:23:26,719
town of

2409
01:23:29,990 --> 01:23:28,320
cortez which is the next town over from

2410
01:23:33,990 --> 01:23:30,000
dolores

2411
01:23:35,910 --> 01:23:34,000
and um went into the auto mechanic and

2412
01:23:37,110 --> 01:23:35,920
said uh well i can take a look at he

2413
01:23:38,870 --> 01:23:37,120
said sure shirley so we

2414
01:23:41,750 --> 01:23:38,880
sit outside and so natasha are sitting

2415
01:23:42,870 --> 01:23:41,760
outside this lovely day

2416
01:23:44,390 --> 01:23:42,880
guy comes out of the back of the

2417
01:23:45,830 --> 01:23:44,400
mechanics shop and he says i can't leave

2418
01:23:49,189 --> 01:23:45,840
i can't let you leave town

2419
01:23:51,430 --> 01:23:49,199
or you'll die and we're like what so

2420
01:23:53,030 --> 01:23:51,440
so that's he explained no no i can't let

2421
01:23:55,270 --> 01:23:53,040
you legally i can't let you leave the

2422
01:23:57,270 --> 01:23:55,280
town or or um you know if you get an

2423
01:23:59,189 --> 01:23:57,280
accident and i'll be liable and such so

2424
01:24:00,790 --> 01:23:59,199
so that's the beginning of this this

2425
01:24:02,790 --> 01:24:00,800
that that account

2426
01:24:04,470 --> 01:24:02,800
the end of it is so we're there we could

2427
01:24:05,910 --> 01:24:04,480
we could get a cheap rent a car actually

2428
01:24:07,430 --> 01:24:05,920
it was a super cheap rental car it was

2429
01:24:09,270 --> 01:24:07,440
really nice and we had a great time

2430
01:24:11,510 --> 01:24:09,280
after that so we drove around and

2431
01:24:12,950 --> 01:24:11,520
and went and had a we went to a navajo

2432
01:24:15,430 --> 01:24:12,960
excuse me

2433
01:24:17,430 --> 01:24:15,440
yes it was it was on hopi land right no

2434
01:24:20,070 --> 01:24:17,440
no excuse me it's on navajo land because

2435
01:24:21,350 --> 01:24:20,080
the the canyon de shea is on the navajo

2436
01:24:25,030 --> 01:24:21,360
reservation so

2437
01:24:26,790 --> 01:24:25,040
we did a um arizona arizona yeah so

2438
01:24:29,350 --> 01:24:26,800
we're right at four corners there so

2439
01:24:31,110 --> 01:24:29,360
so colorado if you look at dolores

2440
01:24:32,629 --> 01:24:31,120
colorado it's right there near the four

2441
01:24:34,629 --> 01:24:32,639
corners area so we just went

2442
01:24:35,910 --> 01:24:34,639
to drove through new mexico to get to

2443
01:24:39,270 --> 01:24:35,920
arizona and then

2444
01:24:40,950 --> 01:24:39,280
um did a uh sweat lodge ceremony

2445
01:24:42,470 --> 01:24:40,960
now there's nothing at all paranormal

2446
01:24:43,430 --> 01:24:42,480
about the sweat lodge ceremony it was

2447
01:24:44,629 --> 01:24:43,440
interesting because i mean i was there

2448
01:24:46,390 --> 01:24:44,639
with bare shirt and

2449
01:24:47,750 --> 01:24:46,400
without a shirt bear chested and had

2450
01:24:48,470 --> 01:24:47,760
this big scratch and everything like

2451
01:24:50,070 --> 01:24:48,480
that and

2452
01:24:51,669 --> 01:24:50,080
it was really beautiful ceremony it's

2453
01:24:54,870 --> 01:24:51,679
really wonderful so

2454
01:24:56,790 --> 01:24:54,880
you know so here this story begins

2455
01:24:59,030 --> 01:24:56,800
with a guy saying you can't leave town

2456
01:24:59,910 --> 01:24:59,040
or you'll die that night we have this

2457
01:25:02,149 --> 01:24:59,920
experience that

2458
01:25:03,430 --> 01:25:02,159
certainly plays out like a ufo abduction

2459
01:25:08,070 --> 01:25:03,440
experience so i have no

2460
01:25:11,189 --> 01:25:08,080
memories of abduction and then

2461
01:25:14,629 --> 01:25:11,199
it ends with this metaphoric

2462
01:25:17,030 --> 01:25:14,639
death and rebirth ceremony

2463
01:25:18,629 --> 01:25:17,040
were performed by this shaman in in

2464
01:25:19,430 --> 01:25:18,639
native american language was really

2465
01:25:21,430 --> 01:25:19,440
powerful

2466
01:25:23,430 --> 01:25:21,440
and you know in its scope this thing now

2467
01:25:25,669 --> 01:25:23,440
so those are the two points on the map

2468
01:25:27,270 --> 01:25:25,679
now in the middle i'll tell this very

2469
01:25:29,189 --> 01:25:27,280
quick because natasha and again we're

2470
01:25:32,229 --> 01:25:29,199
camping this was years after

2471
01:25:34,070 --> 01:25:32,239
and we're sleeping out under the stars

2472
01:25:35,669 --> 01:25:34,080
just like i always do just like natasha

2473
01:25:39,910 --> 01:25:35,679
and i have done many times

2474
01:25:41,990 --> 01:25:39,920
and there's a there's a hooting owl near

2475
01:25:43,350 --> 01:25:42,000
my head while natasha is taking a little

2476
01:25:46,470 --> 01:25:43,360
walk she's jet lagged

2477
01:25:48,709 --> 01:25:46,480
she's been coming from germany and uh

2478
01:25:49,669 --> 01:25:48,719
so there's a hooting owl like near my

2479
01:25:51,189 --> 01:25:49,679
head like i

2480
01:25:52,470 --> 01:25:51,199
can't believe i didn't see it i'm lying

2481
01:25:53,910 --> 01:25:52,480
there looking at the stars listening to

2482
01:25:55,350 --> 01:25:53,920
this owl she's done a little walk she

2483
01:25:56,310 --> 01:25:55,360
runs back and she said mike i saw

2484
01:25:58,390 --> 01:25:56,320
something we gotta go

2485
01:25:59,350 --> 01:25:58,400
she describes seeing a floating white

2486
01:26:01,910 --> 01:25:59,360
orb

2487
01:26:03,590 --> 01:26:01,920
so here's like a ufo an unidentified

2488
01:26:04,470 --> 01:26:03,600
flying object and a white orb it was

2489
01:26:08,149 --> 01:26:04,480
about the size of a

2490
01:26:10,629 --> 01:26:08,159
beach ball or basketball and uh

2491
01:26:12,070 --> 01:26:10,639
and so spooky scary we're out there

2492
01:26:13,430 --> 01:26:12,080
alone in the desert and okay let's get

2493
01:26:14,709 --> 01:26:13,440
out of here so we started driving so we

2494
01:26:15,590 --> 01:26:14,719
started driving like four or five in the

2495
01:26:18,390 --> 01:26:15,600
morning

2496
01:26:19,350 --> 01:26:18,400
uh and that was the middle point on the

2497
01:26:22,470 --> 01:26:19,360
map now what's

2498
01:26:25,990 --> 01:26:22,480
eerie about this is that these three

2499
01:26:28,070 --> 01:26:26,000
events line up to the millionth of a

2500
01:26:29,830 --> 01:26:28,080
millimeter i am convinced when you put a

2501
01:26:32,629 --> 01:26:29,840
straight line on the map

2502
01:26:33,510 --> 01:26:32,639
using google maps they line up with a

2503
01:26:36,950 --> 01:26:33,520
precision

2504
01:26:38,629 --> 01:26:36,960
that just freaked me out

2505
01:26:41,270 --> 01:26:38,639
and this is something that that happened

2506
01:26:43,910 --> 01:26:41,280
as a as a psychic

2507
01:26:44,629 --> 01:26:43,920
vision i had the psychic vision i then

2508
01:26:48,390 --> 01:26:44,639
put together

2509
01:26:49,590 --> 01:26:48,400
this map then i very carefully align the

2510
01:26:50,070 --> 01:26:49,600
points i'm good with maps i knew right

2511
01:26:52,149 --> 01:26:50,080
where i was

2512
01:26:53,910 --> 01:26:52,159
these three nights and it lines up with

2513
01:26:57,030 --> 01:26:53,920
an exactitude that

2514
01:26:58,709 --> 01:26:57,040
that just toppled my brain

2515
01:27:00,550 --> 01:26:58,719
and from that point on this would have

2516
01:27:03,030 --> 01:27:00,560
been march

2517
01:27:04,470 --> 01:27:03,040
12th i mean the event uh the round

2518
01:27:06,149 --> 01:27:04,480
structure on the hill was march 10th

2519
01:27:07,910 --> 01:27:06,159
march 12th a couple days later when i

2520
01:27:09,830 --> 01:27:07,920
actually put all these things together

2521
01:27:12,229 --> 01:27:09,840
um you know basically the old chapter of

2522
01:27:14,629 --> 01:27:12,239
my life of doubting was gone

2523
01:27:15,350 --> 01:27:14,639
in this new chapter of i don't know what

2524
01:27:18,310 --> 01:27:15,360
you would call it

2525
01:27:19,270 --> 01:27:18,320
you know i still don't have an answer

2526
01:27:21,910 --> 01:27:19,280
i'm still questioning

2527
01:27:23,189 --> 01:27:21,920
the sources but i no longer question

2528
01:27:26,950 --> 01:27:23,199
that something

2529
01:27:29,030 --> 01:27:26,960
uh has intersected with my life wow

2530
01:27:30,149 --> 01:27:29,040
what is an owl right in the middle yeah

2531
01:27:32,629 --> 01:27:30,159
right in the middle

2532
01:27:33,430 --> 01:27:32,639
that's interesting it's a great story

2533
01:27:35,189 --> 01:27:33,440
well mike

2534
01:27:37,189 --> 01:27:35,199
i we've come to the end of the interview

2535
01:27:38,070 --> 01:27:37,199
and can you tell people how they can get

2536
01:27:40,870 --> 01:27:38,080
your book and

2537
01:27:41,750 --> 01:27:40,880
uh the website they can possibly contact

2538
01:27:44,709 --> 01:27:41,760
you if they've got

2539
01:27:46,229 --> 01:27:44,719
a story they think you can use sure i'm

2540
01:27:47,030 --> 01:27:46,239
loving it in the story so so go to my

2541
01:27:50,790 --> 01:27:47,040
website which is

2542
01:27:54,390 --> 01:27:50,800
uh a hidden experience

2543
01:27:55,910 --> 01:27:54,400
all one word dot blogspot dot com that's

2544
01:27:58,229 --> 01:27:55,920
hidden experience

2545
01:27:59,030 --> 01:27:58,239
dot blogspot dot com or you can just

2546
01:28:02,390 --> 01:27:59,040
google my name

2547
01:28:04,870 --> 01:28:02,400
mike clelland and then owls it'll

2548
01:28:06,390 --> 01:28:04,880
come right up that's like now uh and

2549
01:28:07,430 --> 01:28:06,400
from that site you can then click on

2550
01:28:08,870 --> 01:28:07,440
something you can get the book

2551
01:28:10,629 --> 01:28:08,880
the messengers title of the book is the

2552
01:28:12,950 --> 01:28:10,639
messenger subtitles owls

2553
01:28:15,189 --> 01:28:12,960
synchronies synchronicity and the ufo

2554
01:28:18,070 --> 01:28:15,199
abductee and you can get that book on

2555
01:28:19,590 --> 01:28:18,080
uh amazon easy enough or through the

2556
01:28:21,750 --> 01:28:19,600
publishers with or excuse me the

2557
01:28:24,790 --> 01:28:21,760
publisher is richard dolan

2558
01:28:25,350 --> 01:28:24,800
and on richard dolan site you can uh you

2559
01:28:27,830 --> 01:28:25,360
can

2560
01:28:28,870 --> 01:28:27,840
uh there's links there too so all right

2561
01:28:31,510 --> 01:28:28,880
well i'll tell you

2562
01:28:33,669 --> 01:28:31,520
when you get your new book done please

2563
01:28:34,390 --> 01:28:33,679
reserve some time to come back and join

2564
01:28:35,750 --> 01:28:34,400
us

2565
01:28:37,430 --> 01:28:35,760
i i would definitely love to have you

2566
01:28:39,030 --> 01:28:37,440
come back

2567
01:28:40,470 --> 01:28:39,040
i would be happy to this was this was

2568
01:28:41,750 --> 01:28:40,480
great and thanks for sharing your owl

2569
01:28:44,229 --> 01:28:41,760
experience because that's i mean

2570
01:28:46,310 --> 01:28:44,239
what you're describing is something that

2571
01:28:47,910 --> 01:28:46,320
is very common but is not

2572
01:28:50,550 --> 01:28:47,920
really reported that often so i feel

2573
01:28:53,510 --> 01:28:50,560
like i've taken it on the role of the

2574
01:28:55,189 --> 01:28:53,520
uh describe or something yeah yeah i

2575
01:28:57,669 --> 01:28:55,199
appreciate you uh listening to it and

2576
01:29:01,270 --> 01:28:57,679
and give me your thoughts that

2577
01:29:04,550 --> 01:29:01,280
yeah it was a profound time and uh

2578
01:29:06,950 --> 01:29:04,560
it kind of did ease things you know so

2579
01:29:08,629 --> 01:29:06,960
i appreciate hey come back again and uh

2580
01:29:11,510 --> 01:29:08,639
thanks again for joining us

2581
01:29:12,470 --> 01:29:11,520
oh definitely thanks so much sleep well

2582
01:29:18,229 --> 01:29:12,480
thank you

2583
01:29:22,390 --> 01:29:20,470
and folks that was mike clelland author

2584
01:29:23,430 --> 01:29:22,400
of the messengers what a good interview

2585
01:29:25,270 --> 01:29:23,440
lon

2586
01:29:27,430 --> 01:29:25,280
yeah that was you know the book is

2587
01:29:31,110 --> 01:29:27,440
fantastic i mean i

2588
01:29:33,189 --> 01:29:31,120
you know i have uh recommended books

2589
01:29:34,310 --> 01:29:33,199
a lot of books over the years but i tell

2590
01:29:37,430 --> 01:29:34,320
you

2591
01:29:39,270 --> 01:29:37,440
this book is just amazing

2592
01:29:41,189 --> 01:29:39,280
it's really even if you haven't had an

2593
01:29:44,070 --> 01:29:41,199
owl experience or anything

2594
01:29:46,229 --> 01:29:44,080
to the contract i mean it is just

2595
01:29:49,750 --> 01:29:46,239
interesting that the stories

2596
01:29:51,990 --> 01:29:49,760
and uh yeah you should definitely get it

2597
01:29:52,870 --> 01:29:52,000
i know you have a copy of it it's it's

2598
01:29:58,310 --> 01:29:52,880
it's just a great

2599
01:30:01,030 --> 01:29:58,320
but it's very interesting

2600
01:30:02,070 --> 01:30:01,040
absolutely all right who do we got next

2601
01:30:05,910 --> 01:30:02,080
week long

2602
01:30:06,790 --> 01:30:05,920
next week let's see here i'm looking at

2603
01:30:09,910 --> 01:30:06,800
it now

2604
01:30:10,950 --> 01:30:09,920
next week we have a jay pocket chain on

2605
01:30:14,629 --> 01:30:10,960
with us

2606
01:30:17,750 --> 01:30:14,639
our friend jay from uh

2607
01:30:20,229 --> 01:30:17,760
wisconsin wpi haunts

2608
01:30:21,110 --> 01:30:20,239
truth that's the truth and uh from

2609
01:30:24,149 --> 01:30:21,120
wisconsin

2610
01:30:27,590 --> 01:30:24,159
uh he has done work with uh

2611
01:30:30,149 --> 01:30:27,600
linda godfrey and uh

2612
01:30:31,669 --> 01:30:30,159
he's independent researcher and he will

2613
01:30:34,870 --> 01:30:31,679
be joining us next week

2614
01:30:36,070 --> 01:30:34,880
and a hell of a nice guy yes he is

2615
01:30:38,310 --> 01:30:36,080
going to be good to have jay on the

2616
01:30:39,270 --> 01:30:38,320
program folks you've been listening to

2617
01:30:41,830 --> 01:30:39,280
arcane radio

2618
01:30:46,830 --> 01:30:41,840
you can learn more about lawn by going

2619
01:30:50,550 --> 01:30:48,229
phantomsandmonsters.com

2620
01:30:52,430 --> 01:30:50,560
you can find out more about me by going

2621
01:30:55,189 --> 01:30:52,440
to my website

2622
01:30:56,310 --> 01:30:55,199
theforkchop.net and that's all we got

2623
01:30:59,390 --> 01:30:56,320
for this week